Assessment of Monk

[Mrs Miggins]

Libertarian - I seriously doubt you're ever "bewildered", sweetie. You watch those throwaway lines, now.

My analogy to the Stoke board was an obvious one in that Pulis is a past manager that they, unlike some of us with Laudrup, probably don't go banging on about all the time. Sensibly, they seem more interested in their current position/signings etc. and yes I've checked. In no way was I comparing the two as managers and I'm discombobulated that you saw it that way. Ooh cheeky!

 

[Bob the slob]

But there was also a split camp under ML and previous results were only showing a downward trend.

As there was under Sousa and one player's name kept cropping up.

 

[LIBERTARIAN]

Who is Laudrup ?????

He's the very same guy you asked the same question about last week,and the week before, and the week before...

The main difference is that he is now a few weeks or so older,and you are a lot more ******.

 

[LIBERTARIAN]

Libertarian - I seriously doubt you're ever "bewildered", sweetie. You watch those throwaway lines, now.

My analogy to the Stoke board was an obvious one in that Pulis is a past manager that they, unlike some of us with Laudrup, probably don't go banging on about all the time. Sensibly, they seem more interested in their current position/signings etc. and yes I've checked. In no way was I comparing the two as managers and I'm discombobulated that you saw it that way. Ooh cheeky!

"Discombobulated". I was wondering how long it would take for this word to appear on this Forum. Nice one,Mrs M,take a bow.

I could say that I am "bewildered" again,when really I'm just "discombobulated".

 

[Mrs Miggins]

Always happy to enlighten, dear.

 

[Matthew Bound Still Lurks]

We wouldn't finish top 6 with Bony anyway. We are more than half way through the season and have never been outside the top nine and are either 8-9 points better off than this time last season. Yet, you'd think we're in a relegation scrap given some comments on here. Yes we are going through a difficult patch atm, but it was always going to be a difficult period after the Xmas schedule in that we had to play WHU, Chelsea and Southampton on the back of losing Bony, Ki, Jonjo being a prat, Montero and Leon yesterday.
When Ki, Montero and Leon return we will then be back on track. Atm it seems to me that one or two are revelling in the difficulties that Monk is facing atm.

There would have been a better chance of achieving it with him still here , taking into account the ACN I believe that if Bony wasn't sold then Gomis would have been ,we'd have muddled through the month with out him then continued onwards and upwards ,his staying would have given everyone a lift including the players and we all know that he wins games. Now we have to adapt for as long as Gomis is with us to him although Emnes does look like he can link up with him (discounting yesterdays farce ) but and that may not reap any benefits for a while ,

 

[Bob the slob]

I've seen this posted numerous times on here from several posters. What did actually happen here as I am still unsure of the events. I thought he left to go to Leicester?

Sousa has recently said he left Swansea too early because he thought he'd get money for transfers at Leicester.

His season was considered by many as a year of boring football, but he was seriously hampered by having no striker who could score or stay fit. He also came in very late (late June) after Roberto left with the back room staff and in the words of Huw Jenkins 'ripping the heart out of the club'. The season before our defending was unbelievably poor, Sousa put a stop to that and it didn't go down well with some in the team. Like Laudrup he wasn't the players' buddy, guardian or keeper, he was typically European in expecting professionals to behave professionally in terms of personal fitness. Some players (old school) didn't like it. Quite a few had been at the club with Roberto and remained very pally when he was manager but all of a sudden they had to contend with a more distant character who took things on face value rather than a nod and a wink. It was the season some players were convinced (but let down) Roberto would come in for them (Scotland left) and this caused some anguish - Pratley & Bodde being high on the list, (Bodde wasn't happy a big move was blocked but was injured soon after), Ash seemed convinced he was going to be offered a contract with Arsenal although he signed an extension (like that makes a difference) and Leon spent much of the year saying he wanted to be closer to his family in London.

Monk only played 26 (compared to Tate's 41) games with a back injury!

The squad was made up with short loans, injury prone and unfit players who were not up to scratch; that including Lee Trundle who had failed at Bristol and came back overweight, slow and still not up to Championship level, Craig Beattie who was quality but injury prone and Kuqui who gave 100% but was aging.

Sousa didn't rate some established players and they tended to make it personal. At that time players were even closer to the playing public than they are now and some very unpleasant things were said especially on Wind Street.

Despite all that was going on off the pitch we improved our position. This is the bit I find confusing, many who lambasted Sousa for boring football are the ones commending Monk and saying it's points that count not the way we get them.

I am convinced we would not have gained promotion under Rogers were it not for Sousa's contribution to our defense and in highlighting to Huw etc that a few quality players will get you further than a squad of mediocrity. We were outstanding until we hit the final third.
We have up until this season, IMO, been living off his legacy in respect of resolve and tactical ability in our back four particularly defending set pieces.

Given his record since leaving Leicester, Sousa has shown just how good a manager he is.

 

[ValleyGraduate12]

Sousa has recently said he left Swansea too early because he thought he'd get money for transfers at Leicester.

His season was considered by many as a year of boring football, but he was seriously hampered by having no striker who could score or stay fit. He also came in very late (late June) after Roberto left with the back room staff and in the words of Huw Jenkins 'ripping the heart out of the club'. The season before our defending was unbelievably poor, Sousa put a stop to that and it didn't go down well with some in the team. Like Laudrup he wasn't the players' buddy, guardian or keeper, he was typically European in expecting professionals to behave professionally in terms of personal fitness. Some players (old school) didn't like it. Quite a few had been at the club with Roberto and remained very pally when he was manager but all of a sudden they had to contend with a more distant character who took things on face value rather than a nod and a wink. It was the season some players were convinced (but let down) Roberto would come in for them (Scotland left) and this caused some anguish - Pratley & Bodde being high on the list, (Bodde wasn't happy a big move was blocked but was injured soon after), Ash seemed convinced he was going to be offered a contract with Arsenal although he signed an extension (like that makes a difference) and Leon spent much of the year saying he wanted to be closer to his family in London.

Monk only played 26 (compared to Tate's 41) games with a back injury!

The squad was made up with short loans, injury prone and unfit players who were not up to scratch; that including Lee Trundle who had failed at Bristol and came back overweight, slow and still not up to Championship level, Craig Beattie who was quality but injury prone and Kuqui who gave 100% but was aging.

Sousa didn't rate some established players and they tended to make it personal. At that time players were even closer to the playing public than they are now and some very unpleasant things were said especially on Wind Street.

I am convinced we would not have gained promotion under Rogers were it not for Sousa's contribution to our defense and in highlighting to Huw etc that a few quality players will get you further than a squad of mediocrity. We were outstanding until we hit the final third.

Given his record since leaving Leicester, Sousa has shown just how good a manager he is.

Cheers for that Bob. I was in Uni at the time so was outside of the Swansea bubble

 

[Bob the slob]

Cheers for that Bob. I was in Uni at the time so was outside of the Swansea bubble

You're welcome. As with our current manager and Laudrup others will have a different version of who said what to whom so I tried to stick verifiable information and what I personally heard / overheard from players, board and others at the club at the time.

 

[DragonPhilljack]

Good post Bob and spot on, I think Sousa was very much underrated, and what he achieved with only Pintado and Trundle was amazing, shame that Huw Jenkins would not give him the £500,000 he wanted for a striker in the January window that he had lined up, I have a feeling we could have at least got into the play-off's then, I really did like Sousa, and while his football was negative, what could he do with no real striker to talk about up front, he gave the Championship the best defence that season though without doubt...

 

[swanseaandproud]

jinx should have backed sousa when he asked for money for a striker what we were desperate for to achieve promotion. Sousa never got the credit he deserved and if the board had only listened to him he would have got us promotion before Brendan did. There was no way he could stay after being let down like he was and he was right to leave when he did.

 

[JackCwm]

I thought Bodde was injured before Xmas 2008 whilst RM was still Manager? Sousa was appointed June 2009 so not sure if he would be expecting RM to come in got him. Derby's offers were rejected when RM was Manager. Hopefully Ferre is fully recovered after his lung problems

 

[Yankee_Jack]

I thought Bodde was injured before Xmas 2008 whilst RM was still Manager? Sousa was appointed June 2009 so not sure if he would be expecting RM to come in got him. Derby's offers were rejected when RM was Manager. Hopefully Ferre is fully recovered after his lung problems

I think this is correct. Bodde was crocked in the Sept/Oct time frame of Roberto's last season, which allowed Gomez to establish himself in our line-up having been riding the bench. Bodde had already scored a few goals by the time he was injured. Bodde, Gomez and of course Scotland were the players who between them scored 40 league goals for Roberto.

Roberto took Scotland and Gomez (who was a loanee anyway) to Wigan. Bodde never recovered. Sousa inherited a squad that had lost 40 goals, without which our goal difference for Roberto's season was -23 .... deep ****.

IMO we are facing deja vue all over again. We have lost Bony ... who I equate to Scotland ... we are similarly ****ed and I see Gomis a lot like Pintado but without the work and intensity to savage Savage. We were incredibly fortunate to get Sousa who did the only thing he could do under the circumstances .... tighten the defense and dramatically lower our goals against. Monk is no Sousa - not even remotely close. And this is the great irony ... to be successful for the rest of the season Monk is going to have to achieve what his mnemisis did, i.e. reduce goals against. And if anybody wants to see the rift between Monk and Sousa check out what happened on the field at the end of the Scunthorpe league cup game.

Bob ... great post.

 

[Mrs Miggins]

Good comments here on the Sousa era and Bob is spot on, but I can't equate the football we play today with that time. I liked Sousa a lot and defensively we were excellent during his time here but for reasons that weren't of his own making we played some of the most boring football I've ever seen under him. Having a striker who scored 7 in 73 appearances didn't help lol.

Ended up high in the League though.

 

[Bob the slob]

I thought Bodde was injured before Xmas 2008 whilst RM was still Manager? Sousa was appointed June 2009 so not sure if he would be expecting RM to come in got him. Derby's offers were rejected when RM was Manager. Hopefully Ferre is fully recovered after his lung problems

Came back for a few games but was still looking for a move if the many reports in Dutch papers were to be believed.
As you say - hope he's improving.

 

[Bob the slob]

Good comments here on the Sousa era and Bob is spot on, but I can't equate the football we play today with that time. I liked Sousa a lot and defensively we were excellent during his time here but for reasons that weren't of his own making we played some of the most boring football I've ever seen under him. Ended up high in the League though.

Agree - some of it was turgid but as you acknowledge there weren't many alternatives.
His teams since Leicester have all been among the highest if not the highest scoring in their respective leagues.

 

[neveroffsidereff]

Sousa has recently said he left Swansea too early because he thought he'd get money for transfers at Leicester.

His season was considered by many as a year of boring football, but he was seriously hampered by having no striker who could score or stay fit. He also came in very late (late June) after Roberto left with the back room staff and in the words of Huw Jenkins 'ripping the heart out of the club'. The season before our defending was unbelievably poor, Sousa put a stop to that and it didn't go down well with some in the team. Like Laudrup he wasn't the players' buddy, guardian or keeper, he was typically European in expecting professionals to behave professionally in terms of personal fitness. Some players (old school) didn't like it. Quite a few had been at the club with Roberto and remained very pally when he was manager but all of a sudden they had to contend with a more distant character who took things on face value rather than a nod and a wink. It was the season some players were convinced (but let down) Roberto would come in for them (Scotland left) and this caused some anguish - Pratley & Bodde being high on the list, (Bodde wasn't happy a big move was blocked but was injured soon after), Ash seemed convinced he was going to be offered a contract with Arsenal although he signed an extension (like that makes a difference) and Leon spent much of the year saying he wanted to be closer to his family in London.

Monk only played 26 (compared to Tate's 41) games with a back injury!

The squad was made up with short loans, injury prone and unfit players who were not up to scratch; that including Lee Trundle who had failed at Bristol and came back overweight, slow and still not up to Championship level, Craig Beattie who was quality but injury prone and Kuqui who gave 100% but was aging.

Sousa didn't rate some established players and they tended to make it personal. At that time players were even closer to the playing public than they are now and some very unpleasant things were said especially on Wind Street.

Despite all that was going on off the pitch we improved our position. This is the bit I find confusing, many who lambasted Sousa for boring football are the ones commending Monk and saying it's points that count not the way we get them.

I am convinced we would not have gained promotion under Rogers were it not for Sousa's contribution to our defense and in highlighting to Huw etc that a few quality players will get you further than a squad of mediocrity. We were outstanding until we hit the final third.
We have up until this season, IMO, been living off his legacy in respect of resolve and tactical ability in our back four particularly defending set pieces.

Given his record since leaving Leicester, Sousa has shown just how good a manager he is.

Top post Bob, Sousa always gets over looked by Martinez and Rodgers, as you say Rodgers benefited from Sousa's work.

 

[swanseaandproud]

With Sousa we ground out results as that was the only option we had, we would defend well and keep the ball flowing abet backwards but now and again there would be an opening and we would take it and win 1-0. it was not pretty and down right boring at times but we were getting results and that was down to Sousa's knowledge of the game, we were desperate for a striker and Sousa was so frustrated that the board at the time could not or would not see this. im glad Sousa has gone on to do great things eventually as he is a very underestimated manager...

 

[Terror ball]

Monk led the Swans under Sousa, who left the Liberty Stadium for Leicester City last month. But he has warned the Foxes players they will be left baffled by some of the Portuguese manager’s methods.
Monk, 31, said: “There was no real reasoning behind any of his methods in training or why we were doing things.
“He knew his stuff but there was no great organisation towards training and mentally that can be difficult to take as a player.
“Every manager is different, everyone’s philosophy is different and Paulo was a lot more laid back than other managers and sometimes we wouldn’t even get a sweat on.
“But having trained with this squad every day I know that’s not what was best for us. Everyone agreed that we need to be pushed but we weren’t allowed to do extra training.”
It is not unusual for disgruntled players to vent their frustration at a former boss who refused to select them in the team. But that Monk was club captain under Sousa makes his comments all the more telling.
He did concede, however, that under the former Juventus midfielder, Swansea did become one of the toughest teams to break down in the Championship, keeping 24 clean sheets – form that took them to within one place of the play-offs.
Monk said: “Defensively we learned a lot from Paulo. We thank him for that and wish him all the best at Leicester, but it was right for him to move on and now we have a manager who is going to work us.”

 

[Terror ball]

In this book, he talks openly and fairly about the top players he's played with and against; of the local rivalry with Cardiff City over the years and of the managers and chairmen he has admired. Paulo Sousa and Peter Ridsdale are not among that group, and he explains why, keeping the most forthright comments in the book for the former Swans manager:
“Looking back now,” says Garry, “I'm glad we didn't get into the play-offs with Paulo, as he did not deserve to be the one to take us to the Premiership. He had not earned that right... In terms of the progression Swansea City had made under Kenny Jackett and then Roberto, I saw Paulo's time in charge as a wasted season. Yes, we finished seventh, which was one place higher than the previous season, but I put that achievement down to the attitude of the players rather than anything Paulo Sousa gave us.”