It's all very well,and certainly true,to say that it's a minority. Nevertheless there were several cases of muslims celebrating the Paris murders. My suspicion is that it's a large minority who support Islamic terrorism. I don't mean actively necessarily. There needs to be a citizenship test whereby everyone who lives in the UK puts all their fellow citizens rights above religion of any type. Faith schools should be closed,all of them.And laws of sex equality enforced rigidly.
I never said start a War with them. I just don't want it spreading and have it phased out in this country. If they want to live that way in Saudi Arabia its entirely up to them, none of my business. One of the big issues is the vast majority are turning a blind eye to whats going on. Letting their kids get mixed up with these idiots because they were so arrogant to think there religion was untainted. When we talk about free speech, do bring Christianity into it, no, its a none religious concept. These people just do not understand it. All moderate muslims are just those that don't believe the book as much as the fundamentalists.
You really are a nutter Carrabuh. I've never come across someone so dogmatic and religious as your attitude and yet claiming not to be religious. I dare say the "moderate" Muslims would categorically disagree. I suspect they'd say they don't believe the unpleasant bits of the book, whereas the fundamentalists don't believe the pleasant bits. It's so contradictory, ultimately you have to be very selective no matter which side you're on. A bit like you really.
When a book is utterly riddled with contradictions, it's pretty hard to argue one interpretation is more correct than another. Just because you choose to follow the nicer bits over the nastier bits doesn't make you less of a believer, it just means you come to less radical conclusions about how to practice your faith.
It's all a load of bollox! All religions should be banned from public life - no exceptions. If anyone wants to pray to their imaginary friend, let them do it in the confines of their own home, and certainly not try to impose their beliefs on to others. What I really do not appreciate is the amount of concessions that have been made to followers of the Islamic faith. Sharia courts aplenty - why? Prayer rooms in the work place Muslim ONLY swimming days Halal food - Muslims can eat non-halal food if it is not available (did you know that?) Paligamy Can anyone tell me what concessions have been made for Jews, Buddhists, Mormons or indeed any faith based group in the UK?
I'm an atheist, I'm dogmatic because the evidence states I should be. Being an atheist is not being religious. You keep reverting to the contradictory nature, it is totally irrelevent. Even moderate muslims believe in death for apostacy Religious people do not think straight, they are apparently guided by some made up being. Thats quite a scary concept generally, I don't want people like that in charge, having any influence. Far worse than any tangible terrorist group in my eyes. http://www.civitas.org.uk/pdf/ShariaLawOrOneLawForAll.pdf Teaching religious beliefs (as truth) in schools is child abuse as far as I'm concerned.
It's quite simply lies made up for the purposes of social control.Divine Right justified royalty for centuries,they just made it up. Now most people have seen the light we have a new bunch of medieval nutters coming along. I'm am an Atheist and they are now murdering Athiests. Charllie Hebdo was a declaration of war on my (non) religion!
Yes, but not all moderate Muslims believe in death for apostates. I'm a bit confused why you don't seem to understand. Islamic law says both. Some choose to believe one, others choose the other. Being an atheist is being religious. There is no difference. It's a strict adherence to a set of tenets. You are very religious and dogmatic. Not just on this, it's the same with your views on football - you are very strict and dictate a very black and white set of principles. That's why what you write is exactly the opposite to the fundamentalists - because you are a fundamentalist yourself. So you see that's why I agree with you on teaching children. They should be free to make their own choice. If it's religion, then fine - that's their freedom of choice. Forcing atheism forcing atheism upon someone is equally bad. Equally extreme.
You are suggesting that Atheism is religious? Well that's just plain crazy. Quite simply show us God,Allah,Buddha etc and I am sure we will all believe the evidence of our own eyes. Religion is merely another form of mental ilness,and we teach it to children. Carrabuh is correct,it's child abuse.
Sorry, what? If atheism is a religion then its single teaching is that there is no god, hence a-theism. There's nothing else to it. No book, no rules, no stories, no meetings, no control. Its a shared opinion, no more a religion than liking carrots.
Being an atheist is not being religious by almost any definition as far as I am aware. I don't think saying religion is a "form of mental illness" is particularly helpful at all, it clearly isn't. It is just a belief in something, nothing makes it an illness. But I take your point having it forced upon healthy is not helpful. However most things are forced upon us. Marketing, media, even the direction we walk around a shopping centre often control our actions to an extent.
Islamic Law states the death penalty for apostates. I've not read anything to say otherwise. I've seen plenty of interviews where this question has been given to any Muslim of reasonable ranking and not a single one denies it. They resist answering but ultimately own up to it. They may not like it, but they do not deny it. Quite often it is perceived as an annoyance that it is not an important point. Being an atheist is not being religious. Its just not believing in religion, if God hadn't been invented, would I be considered religious, of course not. I found this great quote "Atheism is not a structured system with defined rules. It is simply the lack of a belief in the existence of a god, gods or the supernatural. It has no uniform beliefs and is not a means of understanding our existence. Atheism is not philosophy of life. My unbelief in Santa Claus is not a philosophy of life, and thus my unbelief in god isn’t, either." I'm not forcing children to do anything, I'm saying they should not be taught religion as truth. Thats not the same, the World should be explained through sciences. History can have religion, because you are then talking about influence, development and facts.
Well, I'm a Christian and proud of it - to put me in the same bracket as *****s and someone who can!t have rational and moderate thought is quite frankly absurd and offensive. You are out of order sir.
I believe in live and let live, the cartoons from Charlie hebdo are/were deliberately inflamatory and irresponsible. That said the response is not even close to proportionate and inexcusable. I also don't believe in mythical beings in the sky anymore than giant lizards living in the bodies of politicians or Sepp Blatter being a decent and honest human being. For me my worry is the fact that as a religion Islam seems to have a much greater success rate in brain washing their youth. My biggest fear is the already started erosion of our culture with Islam's seeming reticence for integration and acceptance of the indigenous population. Leicester may prove something of a test case as through sheer numbers those of Islamic faith can already exert some degree of local political influence. On the other hand we as a great and tolerant civilisation (maybe not Ipshit) could bring them round, the key is preventing segregation. Segregation breeds mistrust, appithy and resentment. Faith schools must not be allowed, religious education however is now absolutely crucial, muslims, Christians, jedi's, the whole bloody lot need to understand that there are other options but also that believing something else is not grounds for hatred. Living in country of respect and tolerance already moderates many followers of any religion, the trouble starts when they are herded into ghettos and become bitter, observing wealth and success of others, they are then easy meat for hate preachers. As for some of the earlier debate of religious books having both good and bad things preached this is another reason to totally hate religion, any faith worth its salts should only preach positivity in my book, yes protect you and yours, but any inferences to harm to anyone, especially if it's for meerly disagreeing with your faith is evil as far as I'm concerned. Religion the clever and elaborate tool to control people and garner power. Bah! (in italics just for Rob!)
OCF, I know your riposte was in response to Carrabuh,but I made equally strong protests about religion. I come from an Atheist/Socialist background. When I was a child I was force fed religion at school.Taught to sing religious songs,taken to church and preached at. The people who did those things had no right to do so. Atheists have every bit as much right to be offended by the co ercion we suffer from religious people. I am not claiming that there are bad ,but they are misguided.
I think what Rob is trying to say by calling being an atheist 'religious' (sorry if I'm wrong, Rob) is that atheism by its very nature is a set of beliefs about 'religious' issues - in this case that there are no sky pixies. I prefer Christopher Hitchens's description of himself as an anti-theist, which is how I would probably describe myself. I've lived in several countries and there's not much I miss about the UK, but one thing that I do like about the UK is the relative lack of importance of religion there. I think religion (especially the Abrahamic faiths) makes people more, not less, intolerant. Basically it teaches evil things in my opinion and actively encourages believers to fear, shun, dislike, and sometimes hate outsiders. So I would hate to see Islam (or any religion) get into the position of power that Christianity once had. The UK is a better, healthier, more tolerant country for its lack of religious fundamentalism.
We all make our own choices - that's what makes us unique as individuals. I hold no beef against non-believers or people who have belief in other faiths. When I went to school I was forced to do cross country and learn Latin but it did not make me hate the teachers who made me do it.
No, teaching this nonsense as truth is child abuse. You are teaching false information, god created man for instance. its no different to teaching kids that unicorns, yetis and leprechauns are real. Faith teaching is forcing this rubbish on children and brain washing them. There is no such thing as a Christian child. Just a child with Christian parents.
There is a lot of truth in that. When you think about it how many kids have a different religion from the one they were indoctrinated in by parents and or schools. In the few cases where it happens they usually prove to be out and out balm pots. Like these Muslim converts who they get to plant bombs or wear exploding Hush Puppies. These born again fruit cakes are often convicted murderers and the like,or they have suffered some awful crisis and a God botherer comes along and picks them off. A friend of mine,now in his 80's was telling me about his late brother. I knew him in the late sixties,really quiet introverted chap. His brother said the local vicar got him into the choir when he was about ten and controlled his life.He became the organist,remained single all his life. A clearer case of grooming is impossible to imagine and was apparently the talk of the village for about half a century.All God's work of course. I have nothing against gays btw, but I bet the vicar preached agin the playing of the pink oboe.
Just because you've not read something doesn't mean it isn't true, you pillock. I can't believe you would accuse me of arrogance for saying something I didn't say, and yet not see the ridiculous arrogance and ignorance of your own statement. Read this: http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/05/islam-saudi-apostasy-201458142128717473.html You see? Islam is not united in its view on apostasy. You are fundamentally wrong on that point. And this is through Al Jazeera, so a mainstream media organisation. The opposite of being religious is being agnostic, not atheistic. Atheism falls on the religious spectrum, like monotheism, polytheism. But as your quote says, it's not necessarily being an atheist that makes you religious. There are a variety of atheistic religions. As you say, atheism just means belief in no god. A religion is just a belief system. And it is strict adherence to that belief system that makes you religious. So the quote you've chosen is the direct opposite of you, Carrabuh. You consistently spout uniform beliefs. Atheism is your philosophy of life as you often refer to it. I've come across lots of Christians and none of them is so fanatical in their belief system as Carrabuh. Carrabuh is the most religious person I've come across. He is incredibly intolerant of other views and sees everything in his way or you are wrong. He's also actively proselytising. So you see you can be an atheist and not religious. Just like you can be a monotheist and not religious. And so for me, the problems arise when people don't have the freedom to believe whatever they want, which is what Carrabuh is preaching just like the fundamentalists preach (only they want a different narrow teaching). I'm agnostic, so I see no proof of god but also not proof of an absence of god. And I will let you believe what you want to believe.
