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The 2015 Champion Hurdle

Discussion in 'Horse Racing' started by OddDog, Sep 5, 2014.

  1. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor Staff Member

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    Faugheen entered in the Coral Ascot Hurdle this Saturday (same race connections took with Annie Power last year). Might he run? Ballycasey could be on the same boat, has an entry in the Amlin Chase.
     
    #41
  2. Black Caviar

    Black Caviar 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    They wont want Faugheen coming off the bridle before Cheltenham, just like last season, so will be egg and spoon races till then.

    Just a nagging doubt about him in a Champion Hurdle for me, he will be going into the race unproven against the class of Jezki and The New One in a proper race, and while we all know he has the class, was he really made for the Champion Hurdle? Thats my only worry.

    I dont see him winning a battle up the hill with those two to be honest, and it would take something special to have them beat going to the last off a championship gallop, but maybe hes good enough.

    Id want about 4/1 the night before so the prices just now dont interest me in the slightest, with all the hype though there is probably no chance of getting a fair price.
     
    #42
  3. Black Caviar

    Black Caviar 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    The New One slightly hampered <rofl>

    classic
     
    #43
  4. beeforsalmon

    beeforsalmon Well-Known Member

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    The New One and Jezki are far from unbeatable though are they Boris? I would concede they do set the standard but they are very similar horses, so perhaps something new can better the pair? 2 wins from 6 Grade Ones for The New One tells its own story. None at 2 miles. Long time to be getting too heated up for this race though <laugh>

    Love the new siggy by the way! You were such a nice young chap to begin with too <laugh>
     
    #44
  5. Black Caviar

    Black Caviar 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    Mullins is already looking forward to seeing his charge over the larger obstacles next season, saying: "He looks a fair sort. We always thought he was a chaser in the making and I'd prefer to go chasing with him next year.

    Asked to compare Faugheen with his Supreme victor Vautour, Mullins added: "Vautour is a different level."


    Winning owner Rich Ricci has an embarrassment of riches in the novice hurdle division and said: "He's beautiful, he jumped very well.

    "He's been a very difficult horse to keep right, Willie and the whole team have done a magical job to keep him right.

    Mullins "Faugheen doesn't strike me as a Champion Hurdle horse, but who knows"


    11/4 fav in November against last years Champion and should have been Champion.
     
    #45
  6. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Did he mention whether it was a higher or lower level?
     
    #46

  7. beeforsalmon

    beeforsalmon Well-Known Member

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    Time will tell Boris. Let's hope all 3 get there in one piece. One thing I will say is fans of The New One never seem to run out of excuses! As for egg and spoon races surely that's all The New One will run in too unless Twiston Davies sends him over here, and he's never fancied that too often before...
     
    #47
  8. Black Caviar

    Black Caviar 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    Jumped the hurdle half a length behind Jezki, was at least 4 lengths behind him once he got running again after being brought to near enough a walk, losing all momentum, in a Champion Hurdle.....

    Sometimes excuses are valid, who would have won a decent Champion Hurdle after that misfortune?

    And the egg and spoon thing wasnt an insult to Faugheen, I like him as much as the next guy, maybe not as much as Mullins fanboys but the reality is thats how they are training him for the race because hes obviously not the most robust horse.
     
    #48
  9. beeforsalmon

    beeforsalmon Well-Known Member

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    A whole lot's been made about the hampering and in summary I feel it's a fair bit of pocket talk, as harsh as that may seem! My take on it is it happened so early on, before the race was really on, he was able to creep back into it quite easily. If it had have happened in the last third of the race it would have been a bigger factor and could well have cost him the race. Credit to Sam and the horse they got himself into the perfect possy at the top of the hill but when the principles quickened he was caught out. He's simply run on up the hill once the race is over. The speed horses quickened but not for the first time The New One couldn't. That was where his race was lost.

    Let's not forget he was also beat in the Christmas Hurdle by My Tent who upheld the Kempton form at Cheltenham. If the Champion was 2m2f or in really deep ground it would suit him so much better where his flat spot can be compensated by his strong stamina, which is his true forte in my view.
     
    #49
  10. smokethedeadbadger

    smokethedeadbadger Well-Known Member

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    Spot on
     
    #50
  11. Black Caviar

    Black Caviar 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    Kempton form just backs up the assertion that The New One would have won barring the accident. Hes always going to do better against My Tent at Cheltenham than he will at Kempton.

    In my opinion you cant drop lengths and momentum at any stage in a Champion Hurdle, its not 3 miles at a crawl round some gaff, it would have been anything but easy to get back into that race at that pace regardless of however you interpret the visual impression and there is no doubt it cost him something, its as simple as that for me and I think its absurd to suggest otherwise.

    For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. You run into a fallen horse at that speed, you can rest assured its cost you plenty of energy and momentum.

    To make light of it, and disregard it just because it wasnt at the end of the race is nonsense, every yard is vital in a Champion Hurdle.

    Would he have definitely won? No one can say, but I defy anyone to say he wouldnt have went ****ing close.
     
    #51
  12. cityhull

    cityhull Well-Known Member

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    The amount of energy he wasted getting back into the perfect position at the top of the hill meant he had no energy when they quickened. If he didn't use that energy to get back in the race then I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have lost as much ground when they did quicken and therefore when stamina kicked in over the last he would have been closer to challenge.
     
    #52
  13. DreverSpur

    DreverSpur Well-Known Member

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    I just watched the race again to remind myself of it and that is a very fair assessment in my opinion. I don't think being hampered ended the race for TNO. As stated above, he stayed on when the race was over and isn't a genuine 2 miler.

    As for 2015, I will no doubt be having a couple of sentimental quid on HF. I couldn't back Jezki for a repeat win and neither could I back TNO who I think should be targeting the World Hurdle. With MTOY out, I'm siding with Faugheen at the moment but I don't feel there is any value in 3/1 this far out and I expect it will go off at 5/4 on the day which will probably make it a no bet for me. Hurricane Fly it is then!!
     
    #53
  14. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor Staff Member

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    Willie Mullins tells the Racing Post that Faugheen is an intended runner at Ascot. Top-priced 4/9 for Saturday's race, is this a licence to print money?
     
    #54
  15. cityhull

    cityhull Well-Known Member

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    Doubled up with The New One at Haydock and you get virtually even money
     
    #55
  16. TopClass

    TopClass Well-Known Member

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    A Championship level gallop where momentum is badly lost is a major deal. We can argue about it until the cows come home but remember the most important and saddest part of that episode is that Our Conor isnt coming back this year.

    Time to let the horses do the talking and answer the what ifs and what if nots.

    Faugheens biggest test will be his jumping above all else I think it is fair to say? He looked better at 2m at Punchestown but he did dominate- will he ride like that all season?
     
    #56
  17. beeforsalmon

    beeforsalmon Well-Known Member

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    People are surely more worried about The New One's jumping though. This horse is into his 3rd season and has had a dozen starts over hurdles and he's still looked suspect in that rubbish race he won on comeback! Don't forget Faugheen was only a novice last season, with 5 starts, and clearly has scope to improve with experience. He jumped much better at pace in his last start as well. If he still makes blunders after a dozen starts I'd be as worried as I would be about TNO!

    2 wins from 6 Grade Ones would worry me more mind!
     
    #57
  18. Bostonbob

    Bostonbob Well-Known Member

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    Our Connor was the best horse in last years renewal and would have won the race with a bit in hand.

    TNO is a very good horse. Nothing more or less. I'm not getting into the argument again this season. He might win the Champion Hurdle this year but he is relying on there being nothing better than what we saw last season. If any of the youngsters are a step up then he won't win. If they aren't he has every chance.

    Beefy - no matter how often you deflect it, you can't seriously criticise another horses jumping and at the same time think it's not an issue for Faugheen. I guarantee there's no bigger fan of that young horse than me but he is a flaky jumper and one reasonable jumping performance at Punchestown doesn't mean he's definitively turned the corner. This weekend may tell us more about that element.
     
    #58
  19. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor Staff Member

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    Vautour entered in a novice chase at Navan on Sunday - don't do it Rich, don't do it <wah> (no I haven't had a penny on him for the Champion Hurdle)
     
    #59
  20. Dexter

    Dexter Well-Known Member

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    Oddy,I think that is the same race Flemenstar won three ago at a remarkable odds against.

    Ballycasey won it last year so it has a reasonably good recent roll of honour.
     
    #60

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