Ched Evans

When I was consulting the Home Office on criminal intelligence, it was abundantly clear that they were up to their eyeballs in **** with regards to rape statistics.

One of the first projects I advised on was their 'street workers', hundreds of reports of rape were reported by the prostitutes but the officers each told me the same thing when I was going through cases, that they'd caught the prostitutes in the act and to avoid being prosecuted they'd accuse the 'customer' of raping them. Each case would get taken so far, then the only reason it would be eventually discarded is because the prostitute had either disappeared off the face of the earth or she'd been found dead.

I had to advise on how to manipulate data to prove that 'rape' was not a problem in the area (which is wasn't, there were almost no genuine cases of it) at a great cost to the Home Office for my time. In the end it went national to restructure the way rape was recorded as a crime.

I didn't stick around long enough, or care enough to find out what happened, but I assume they're not treating all rapes 'across the board'.

There's no end to the amount of data manipulation that goes on in the Home Office, I don't for one second believe any 'stats' they produce to show they're doing a great job.

 

I understand your point MrRaw, but unfortunately the term rape is generic term for an act of sex without consent, it would be difficult to change that now, mainly because sentencing is based on precedent, so if you changed the name of the offence new precedents would need to be set.

Sentencing guidelines and precedents allow for degrees of rape and sentences reflect that.

Your last point we have all been in that situation, (you didn't drink at the Garden Farm in Chester-Le-Street did you) and yes they could have been charged but I wouldn't dare make a complaint

 

I know I have & how many women have willingly shagged a bloke & then cried rape after feeling guilty for cheating on their partners?
He says it was consensual sex, she says it was rape, no signs of violence.
How can it be proved beyond reasonable doubt.

The pissed bit should be scrapped - too pissed, tough ****.

 

Fair do's, seems they dropped themselves in it then. If she was that pissed, he should have known better to be honest that's just sheer naivety at best.

I've a lot more respect for Jessica Ennis for disassociating herself with Sheffield United than I would if she sat on the fence.

 

By the way, the COACD didn't find the Birmingham six not guilty, they found that the conviction was unsafe that doesn't mean they didn't carry out the bombings

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ched-evans-jessica-ennis-hill-twitter-4626991

Trolled with rape, for voicing her opinion and protecting her interests. A British Olympic gold medallist. I'm not even gonna say it... f**ing pathetic.

 

There aren't in the eyes of the law though and that's a major issue with how the system currently deals with the crime

There's merely rape and rape plus an aggravating factor.

First offence rape carries a recommended 5 yr custodial sentence.

First offence rape plus an aggravating factor e.g. abduction, carries a recommended 8 yr term

So a first offence violent rape carries the same sentence as a 'date rape'

 

You have just contradicted yourself and agreed with me

The degrees are called Aggravating and Mitigating factors, look them up

 

Their convictions were quashed and they each received payouts for their wrongful imprisonment of circa £1m a piece.

 

They received compensation for an unsafe conviction, this is getting boring now

 

I've done nothing of the sort, try reading what I posted correctly fella.

and I don't have to look it up.......

There is no 'degree' in the act of rape itself in the eyes of the law, so you're completely incorrect

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...ees-of-severity-involved-in-rape-9635662.html

The US does make a distinction has 1st, 2nd and 3rd degree rape charges.

 

You're merely playing with semantics, they were wrongly convicted - the end.

 

I am not talking about US law and probably shouldn't have used the word degree, as it has obviously confused you. I'm talking about sentencing using mitigating and aggravating factors

 

You must have missed the bit where I clearly said;

The only mitigating factor that would reduce the latters sentence would be if she'd said yes to him before........otherwise the offence is viewed in exactly the same way. That's where the problem lies in the British system.

RAPE CRISIS: SEPT 2013

 

Monty, you are really missing the point. The fact is, he is a convict through incorrect charges. There are thousands upon thousands of cases over history where people have been wrongfully convicted, so you can't keep saying "Regardless, he is a rapist" as the simple fact is he isn't. My point of view is not misogynist whatsoever no matter what you say. By you calling me that, its as if you don't acknowledge that women are equally as cheap as men. Women are not some sort of higher being, they should be held to the same standards of men in morale decency, just like feminists have been fighting for for generations!

I hope you have had a good look at the evidence, and seen that by no means was she of "incapacitated state" as she clearly was sober enough to walk in shoes that catwalk models would struggle in, whilst balancing a pizza in one hand, and bending over to the pavement to pick up her pizza and waltz into a hotel without the slightest of stumbles. Is what Ched did seedy, yes, is it illegal, not by my accounts and most people in the world, otherwise all drinking that has ever led to sex, means half of the adult population would be serving a sentence by now!

You can beat your drum all you like, your technicalities won't change common sense facts. Will it be overturned? Probably in 10 years. But if you think that people are going to say "Yeah, the system failed him, and we are sorry for not doing our jobs properly?" then that will never happen anytime soon!

 

There is no such offence as date rape, the offence is rape

The starting point for rape of a victim over 16 is 5 years in custody

The starting point for rape of a victim over 16 accompanied by an aggravating factor is 8 years in custody

I suspect that we actually agree with each other about all three subjects we have crossed swords over, but we use different terminology to express our views.

I don't know how Evans was found guilty on the evidence presented (but he was) and I suspect that it will be overturned by the CCRC

The Birmingham six had their conviction quashed at the COACD because it was unsafe (only a retrial can provide a not guilty verdict)

There are not degrees of rape (I used the wrong terminology) there are starting points for sentences following a conviction of rape taking into account various factors such as age of victim, then there are aggravating factors which would increase the sentence one of them being the use of violence.

 

I think we are all in agreement that something need s to be looked at regarding the law in these cases..

 

That is all your opinion pal. Nothing else. Monty is absolutely correct in what he's saying and I don't know how many other times the lad can say it. Ched Evans was found guilty in a court of law, therefore in the eyes of this land, that man IS A CONVICTED RAPIST. Regardless of what you THINK happened, the fact will remain that he has been found guilty of rape. If, like a lot of people believe and Monty has stated that Ched Evans rape charge is overturned then and only then can people correctly say he is not guilty of rape, because at the moment, he most certainly is guilty.

By the way, I don't believe he raped her.

 

No I think you are missing the point, or know nothing about the law

Who said that the charges are incorrect, you? unfortunately that means nothing, he was charged and convicted of rape, I do not keep calling him a rapist, in fact I don't think I ever have, I merely said numerous times that he has been found guilty and convicted of rape which is true.

whatever you or I think is immaterial, his guilt was decided by a jury and they convicted him.

I am not beating my drum, but if you think Evans is the victim and the system failed him then I am afraid that says a great deal about you.

 

Too true MrRaw, now I am off for a pint