Obviously buying a proper DM and another CB would help, but there's nothing we can do about that right at the moment. For me the things we need to address: *Don't play Monreal at CB, he is an accident waiting to happen each game. Decent enough back up LB but should never be in central defence. Until Kos is back play Chambers there and Bellerin at RB, both are good enough to play in those positions. *If we are winning we need to protect our lead and that means midfield players coming back to do their defensive duties. Especially without a proper recognised DM it's even more important that the likes of Ramsey, Wilshere, Rosicky, Cazorla, Ox, all remember to get back and help the deep lying midfielder. Flamini has come in for some criticism, but he can't do it on his own. *If the MF sit deeper, then it allows the fullbacks to get forward to counter. Also we could just leave players like Sanchez, Walcott and Welbeck up front, one ball over the top would turn the oppo around. *We need to learn to break up oppo play, even if that means doing a 'chelsea' and playing a bit dirty, little trips, fouling, body checks anything to make sure that the oppo don't build a head of steam and carve though our MF. It might be a bit frustrating to watch, but it's effective. *Overall mentality of trying to outscore the oppo just leaves us wide open. I'd much rather see us win games 1-0 and park the bus than having a heart attack everytime we play. That means shutting up shop when we need to. This has been an problem of ours for ages because Wenger buys attacking players, so their natural instinct is to get forward. We have players like Walcott, Oxo, Sanchez, Ozil, Welbeck, we don't need every other player other than the CBs to be trying to get in the box to score. Thoughts ?
Agree with all that - and point 4 is a very good point - I've always been annoyed at the way Flamini and Arteta pick up lots of yellows for needless fouls in pretty routine areas, but never 'break up' play or stop a break with a careful foul and pick up a yellow that way.
Arteta can be very good at breaking up play with little fouls and shirt grabs etc.. The problem is as he ages he is having to give away needless free kicks and pick up needless cards to make up for losing the little pace he had. All Spanish players seem to have this in there locker. Cazorla is fiesty and with the right guidance could learn to play to close out games. Ramsey last season had made more tackles than any player in the league before his injury. Last night he showed signs of this fight early on but doesn't seem quite up to speed yet. With an Arteta-Ramsey midfield duo I think we have our best chance of closing out games. Last season it worked really well to bring flamini on but he has been rubbish this season and just creates chaos. Hopefully diaby is able to offer us another physical option at times prior to January. At the back I think monreal has been decent considering he isn't a CB and I hope he will learn from this stint in the role and develop in his LB role by understanding the CBs beside him better. But I'd rather see chambers at CB and bellerin out on the right. Monreal is a great option to play in front of Gibbs to close games out, he just isn't first choice material. There's definitely work that can be done prior to adding any players.
When Wenger leaves? Or do you think it'll be new players coming in, or will it take that long for the team to adapt to a more defensive structure? Can only see you meaning that it won't happen until Wenger leaves, and surely buying defensive players has to happen this summer! (Although you guys have been banging that drum year on year for ages now...)
Correct New players but same conductor = no significant change. We just need to accept it for a couple of years. Things that most people think 'have' to happen very rarely correlate to what Wenger thinks 'has' to happen. And even if by some chance he goes and buys a couple of defenders and defensive midfielders, I can't see it making a difference to our annual 4th place and 2nd round of CL finish. There's something we need more than defenders or defensive midfielders... it's 2-3 years of patience
Wenger has made defensively solid teams in the past and he can do it again. The key is actually signing the right players. I can't see Wenger changing his style (although this has changed slightly over the years) but some much needed athleticism and aggression in midfield would make a massive difference. Arteta is a solid player but he's not a DM and doesn't play like one. Flamini has no concept of positioning and despite a good workrate he is all over the shop in big games. I have to say.. I can't help but think Diaby is big reason why Wenger hasn't signed this type pf player. Much like when RVP was constantly out and we never added a striker. He sticks with his squad which from some perspectives is a good thing but in this case its just plain stupid. I don't just think our defenders needs some cover(which they do), I also think Ozil would be 10 x better with a solid player behind him.
We need that defensive style midfielder, but we also need to change our style of play when need be. When 3-0 up, was it necessary to bring on attacking players? It would have been prudent to go to defensive or players that could close the show. Drop to a more defensive formation and just ride it out.
I'd argue in all his years here he's only ever had two defensively solid teams, and the first of those he didn't build, he just inherited. The only one he can claim to have built is the Campbell, Toure one. And even then, how do you know he can do it again though? You could also argue that he's built title winning teams before, yet doesn't appear able to do it again. The problem is that these were teams built over a decade ago. Times change. And it appears he can't do it anymore. Hoping success from a long, long time ago can be repeated is something scousers do.
What about Mikel from Chelsea - he is a solid DM and has the physicality that we need or is too old now
The OP is asking what this team can do now. We all want a DM and some think getting rid of Wenger will solve our problems, but I'm interested in what tactically people think this team should do now to fix our defensive frailties.
Switch from the 4141 to a more solid 4231 with Ramsey & Arteta sitting, as worked last season. Play Chambers in the middle and Bellerin on the right - make that centre of defense solid. Do not play Flamini on large pitches. Play Theo & Sanchez as wingers as they track back, Ox isn't too bad either.
so we need to buy a DM and a CB at least in January [and forget Diaby "the return of him is like a new signing for us " bollocks]. so who do we realistically think AW will buy ? we need to put our collective thinking caps on here and come up with sensible suggestions that fit in with the AW way of doing things. so lets think of all the players we can get for free, or have a tendency to get injured, or are really short, or actually attacking midfielders and have no defensive traits whatsoever. seriously though i would take anyone who is prepared to run over every inch of grass non stop, who will kick the **** out of opponents, who will not make any stupid 50/50 passes that the opposition benefit from, and who will never set foot across the halfway line unless its to change ends. so Tiote, or Joey Barton anyone ?
Are there no decent young centre backs in the youth teams who could be flung in at the deep end? Playing a natural centre back, despite lack of experience, is always going to be better than playing two blatant out and out full backs, ie Chambers and Monreal. There was a situation at Celtic a good few years ago and this kid who none of us knew much of and of little experience got thrown in, John Kennedy, his performance in the Nou Camp against Barcelona was like Baresi in the 1994 world cup final. He burst on the scene as if from nowhere and suddenly looked the best player to come through in years but his career was cut short just as fast after a horrendous tackle in his international debut, a friendly no less. Surely there must be someone there who is worth a short, from the man who keeps the faith with Yaya Sanogo, might just be the making of someone and it cant be any worse than the full backs, having Mertesacker next to him would be perfect.
Our youth set up is not good enough. We produce the odd player, (Wiilshere) but the last defensive player we produced was Gibbs.
Saw an interesting stat today. Wellbeck is averaging around TWICE as many clearances from our own box per game than Nacho Monreal. Despite the fact that he only comes back to defend at set pieces. Nacho Monreal is evidently too small for this position. He is averaging only 2 effective clearances per game from our own box while Wellbeck is averages 4 clearances. (Koscielney gets on average 5.5 per game - Mertesacker 6.5)
