We have been talking about Israel/Palestine, Europe and Scottish Independence recently. So how about Ukraine. I for one am seriously worried about the behaviour of Mr Putin in this light and such actions have led to international wars in the past. From the BBC website: At least 2,593 people killed since mid-April (not including 298 passengers and crew of Malaysian Airlines MH17, shot down in the area) - UN report on 29 August 951 civilians killed in Donetsk region alone, official regional authorities said on 20 August In some particularly dangerous places, such as Luhansk region, victims are said to have been buried informally, making accurate counts difficult Rebels (and some military sources) accuse the government of concealing true numbers 260,000 people have fled elsewhere in Ukraine while at least 814,000 have gone to Russia. Thoughts?
We're dealing with a uniquely difficult situation here Yorkie. The Ukraine has 13 nuclear power stations - all of them being the same model as that in Chernobyl - the closest of these to the conflict zone is only about 100km. This fact alone should lead us to Realpolitik as opposed to gungho reactions - ie. NATO simply cannot move in here as in other situations. Realistically there is no way now that areas with a Russian majority population can be reincorporated into the Ukraine - whether we like it or not.
I suspect the absolute "best" outcome for the Ukraine would be for it to devise a new constitution which gave devolved government to "Russian" areas - a bit like the Scotttish Parliament WITHIN a UK The West cannot possibly use force so close to the Russian border. I suspect we will see a Crimea type solution before this is ended.
I cant see why they haven't gone to that yet... mind you perhaps that is the pressure Russia is putting on... BUT they keep talking about statehood.. .which is probably why the Ukrainian govt cant go there... This is just another example of bullying... as per Israel.... although yes the two situations are not comparable
Vladimir Putin is a very dangerous man. There are still people in Russia who do not agree with the breaking of USSR and would like to reform that and Valdimir Putin is one of them. The expanding of Rússia is nothing to them if they have to destroy something that is not theirs. What is not reported is that HvÃta-Rússland still has a communist government who are Stalinist in the way they work. There are big Rúss populations in Eistland, Lettland, Litháen and Moldóva who all wish to return to Russia and will stir trouble for the local majority populations. Rússia will come to the "defence" of their brother Rúss. Finnland fought two wars against Russia to keep them out and only stopped when Russia took Viipuri or Vyborg and KarelÃa.
Yes - it is the EU/ NATO aspect that appears to have stirred Russia into action - but as Ak says there are large minority Russian populations in Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia and Moldova. All could be encouraged if those in Ukraine get their way. I do not see any comparison to the Israeli situation. Israel occupies land it did not possess and is settling it with its own people - a very different scenario. The most close comparison is pre WWII with Czechoslovakia where there was a very significant German minority enabling Hitler to subjugate the Sudetenland.
and, I dare say intelligent, so he won't do anything too rash! However, he does hold a lot of gas that goes to Europe, maybe his Ace in the hand.
Interesting interview on BBC News Hard Talk with, I think, the Ukranian Interior Minister (or equivalent) who was making the point of how Ukraine gave up it's nuclear weaponry as part of it independence and how they feel utterly betrayed by both Russia and the West (not that we can really do an awful lot about it). He has a point in that their sovereignty has been stomped on by Putin. He is playing a dangerous game but he has been consistent: he has tightened his grip on Russia and is seeking to strengthen his borders. He obviously does not trust Washington/London/Berlin. Daft really (subject to some right wing ultra Christian Dominionist numpty getting into power in the US, which is entirely possible) when the real threat to Russia comes from the Middle East and Islamic sympathisers within their own country, same as for the rest of us.
