Will we end up like Southampton?

I'm going to pm you about my dad Filey.

 

we are at least equal to Saints on relegation odds ,

Both of us are current;y 7/2

 

Unless you do not regard honesty as a core element of business behaviour towards a customer base, then I fail to recognise any logic or sense in your argument.

No we didn't, we under-achieved. We came runners up in a FA Cup final that we had progressed to through a protracted knock- out competition. We were worthy competition runners- up and unlucky match losers. We could and should have finished higher; our run- in was poor. There was not the slightest hint of over-achievement, just a pleasant sense of surprise and satisfaction.

Have you become an Allam apologist? You seem to be ignoring words, actions, timing and context.

 

Fez,

I haven't become an Allam apologist. I just don't see anything dishonest in saying watching football should be free. I can also see why he would think he hasn't changed the club's logo. He could argue that saving the club is his gift to the people of Hull and the threat to walk away more a childish threat than an indication of dishonesty.

I think there is a lot wrong with his running of Hull City and his attitude towards the council and sections of our support, but I don't think he's dishonest. Pretending he doesn't want success, that he hasn't invested in the playing squad to achieve success and he isn't investing in the future development of our youth structures is not going to help any future campaign if he decides to reapply to change our name.

 

Message to the Mods, i think someone has hacked into Obadiah's account.

Saying football should be free, then saying the fans only contribute 7% of income, then going on to increase ticket prices.
I can see why he thinks he has'nt changed the logo. Its not the same as last year, its changed, how can anyone not see that ?

All in all i am happy ( ish ) with the running club, but there are some things that are indefensible.

 

If you want a debate about why I think the way I do why not put a few counter arguments. If you don't want a debate I find your post very amusing : )

"I think there is a lot wrong with his running of Hull City" doesn't imply I am happy (ish), just the opposite.

 

I can see what Obi's saying. There's a fair bit that's been done that's at best ill-advised, and his public PR's ****e, but other bits have been great. He's having a rapid learning curve, in with that he'll have learned who have Hull City's interests at heart.

 

I put up two points to debate.
Football should be free, he is in a position to give it, yet puts ticket prices up by 30% whilst claiming our money in overall terms is almost nothing. Why say things you don't mean
He clearly said he would'nt change the logo, he has. That in my opinion is indefensible.

The last line was mine, I am happy ish with the running of the club. ( I did'nt want to suggest you are happy ish with the running of the club ) As long as we stay premier league the income can cover the new signings. Should the day come when we do a Southhampton ( lose a good manager, sell off our assets ) then we are in the ****.
I should use quotation marks better, these are Mr Allam's word's you seem to be defending.

Hope this makes sense.

 

Thanks for the explanation, it makes a lot more sense to me now.

I was asked to justify my opinion that he is basically an honest business man. He said football should be free when he bought the club. A lot has changed since then. He has lent the club close to £100 million to get us premier league football. He will have looked at the books for this season and calculated roughly what he needed to consolidate our position in the Premier League and put up the prices accordingly. I find that understandable, I may disagree with what he did and how he did it but I don't think he should be held to account for a remark he made on buying the club.

The club needs to talk to a representative group of fans to take on board what we think and be prepared to shift a little now and again. I put the price increase in that bracket.

Yes he has changed the logo, but do you think he thought the logo included Hull City AFC The Tigers. If the FA had agreed the name change do you think the logo would have remained Hull City AFC The Tigers? I don't. Which means did he think the logo was only the Tiger's head? It is possible.

For me the issue was the lack of dialogue between the fans and the club. If he wants the fans group to succeed he needs to ensure that we discuss all the issues surrounding the club before the decisions are taken to allow, as far as possible, fans to put their points across. He may even, sometimes, agree to give us what we want.

The Omega Man asked did I think we would do a Southampton. My reply was I think he's basically honest and when he says he wants the club to be successful that's what he means. I don't think he's the type of person to say I want Champions League football for Hull City and then sell our best players to get some of his money back.

Rather than create straw men to knock down I'd rather we concentrate on the major problems, as I see it, at the club. Ending the name change debate, rebuilding trust between the fans (or sections of them) and the owners, making sure a forced eviction doesn't happen again (yes I know some people are happy with the move), changing the way we sell ourselves to the community. For f****** sake we are closing the South Stand for our first European game without even trying to sell the tickets.

I just feel that to progress as a club there needs to be a coming together to consolidate what we have achieved.

The elephant is: he has the right to try and change the name, because he owns Hull City Tigers Limited and I have the right to campaign against it because Hull City is a football club not a limited company. Put the elephant in the long grass and I see no reason why, if all sides are willing, we cannot develop a healthy and fruitful fans liaison committee.

 

I am not going to answer any particular post, as they are drifting away from the point. Is Allam an honest man? I believe that his dealings with the media and supporters has given ample evidence that he is not - and no, I am not going to list them as there have been ample threads, posts and articles that support my view. He may have a different take on what constitutes honesty, but that is for him to manage and others to judge. Picking selective truths or, to be more to the point, truths you assume he really means (you couldn't make this up) does not detract from the clear and shameless lies, deceit and blackmail he uses to manipulate those a too keen for his largesse. Accept what he does and be happy, but do not try to dress it as anything other than what it has been.

 

You have written a lot of words but not actually said anything of content. Not sure what your points are

I see many posts on my facebook relating to the number of words written. Sadly a state of society these days that the number of words matters

 

I'd say going to a meeting with a firm commitment to publish the minutes of that meeting then not do it is very dishonest.

 

Not going to be so petty and go back and find all your old post's, but i get the impression you are defending him more now than 6 months ago. A few others see it the same as well. Thats not being critical, we can all change our minds ( if thats what you have done ) its just how i see it.

 

He did do reach, he had that paper he showed you all.

And he did consult with fans, when you met him.

Small truths but truths nonetheless.

 

I don't think he'll do a Southampton because in his business dealings I suspect he's hard but fairly honest.

 

I was one of the biggest critics of that poor decision, but I do not agree it was dishonest. It was, allegedly, the result of a vote between CTWD officials not to publish. Those who lost the vote are an unknown element, but they honoured the agreed vote outcome; I would say that was honest. Not making the results public was wrong and is still wrong; now, it would appear, at least one of those voter's has decided to take a very strange view of the events of that time and I fail to see how an honest appraisal of those events can result in the explanation we have read on here. Does the continued debt growth and protracted name and badge shenanigans mean we should rid our memories of the deceit, dishonesty and manipulation of Assem Allam? Is our success all the sweeter because some of us might convince the rest to have convenience memories? I find this very strange and concerning.

 

Ah management by committee, it never works.