I think you are mistaken - I believe the Green Party is firmly pro EU. They seek reform of it - not our withdrawal - which happens to accord with my own views - are you calling me a tree hugging bigot?
MEP - Euro Elections
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I think you are mistaken - I believe the Green Party is firmly pro EU. They seek reform of it - not our withdrawal - which happens to accord with my own views - are you calling me a tree hugging bigot?
I doubt that all of those who voted for UKIP were of the bigot persuasion, but in casting their votes the way they did they will probably be the catalyst for much needed reform of EU's powers. The result of that election was the boot up the arse that the main parties needed to push for reform, even if the push is no more than them trying to ensure their political future. I suspect that reform was what many wanted - and your kids may well have cause to thank those bigots.
I am quite sure you are correct and not ALL of those who voted UKIP were bigots. However I have yet to see one interviewed who did not give their reason for wanting to leave the EU as anything other than immigration. My kids dislike bigots as much as I do - people who judge others as groups based on ethnic origin, race, colour or nationality are bigoted by definition.
I want to see reform of the EU as much as many others but I do not blame any of our problems on immigrants as such.
yorkshirehornet
Well-Known Member
Green party policies are actually quite sound..... and they are pro EU but not as it currently stands...
Unfortunately there is a lot of bigotry in all the stereotypes of political parties..... but I don't hug trees.... although I admit to trying it in the late 60s
I can assure you that the Green Party of England and Wales did not stand on an anti EU agenda, and, as a member of the Green Party in Germany (Bundnis 90 Die Grünen)) I know what I'm talking about here. The party is in favour of a referendum but is against leaving (like Cameron) - they believe in reforming some aspects of the EU. from within. I also somewhat resent being referred to as a tree hugging bigot here and would be gratefull for a more concrete criticism of the party which I can answer.
I received a campaign leaflet from The Green Party that clearly stated that if they could not get the reforms they required in the EU they would consider leaving it and they are vehemently anti the Euro. They are also pro Independence for Scotland and Catalonia.....so they really favour small government and not macro scale government that the EU and it's huge Empire represents.
Not being nice being called a bigot because of your beliefs of the role of unelected Governments in your life is it?
I actually think that the Greens have a lot of policies that make a lot of sense and I would whole heatedly support, but they, along with all mainstream parties, are deluded if they think the EU will change. Our glorious PM is leading the charge in Brussels as I type, trying to encourage a spirit of change - no doubt as with some of his predecessors he will return waving a totally worthless piece of paper. If he's lucky he will get the a change in the shade of Blue on the EU flag.
Not being nice being called a bigot because of your beliefs of the role of unelected Governments in your life is it?
I actually think that the Greens have a lot of policies that make a lot of sense and I would whole heatedly support, but they, along with all mainstream parties, are deluded if they think the EU will change. Our glorious PM is leading the charge in Brussels as I type, trying to encourage a spirit of change - no doubt as with some of his predecessors he will return waving a totally worthless piece of paper. If he's lucky he will get the a change in the shade of Blue on the EU flag.
Media bias probably - either there's no value for them in reporting that, or, more likely, they are under orders not to...
The Green Party works under the principle of 'act locally and think globally`both in England as in Germany. The English Greens lay more emphasis upon decentralization - believing that democracy is best served when the decisions which affect peoples lives are made as close to them as possible. You will find that many English Greens are not only against the Euro but are in favour of local currencies as against Sterling - believing that by this method money will stay within a community. The Greens are in favour of Scottish and Catalan independence because they believe in a Europe of 'regions' rather than of large nations - also, all they are saying here is that if the Scots want it they should have it - which is what most of us think anyway. Whilst believing that 'small is beautiful`they also realize that some aspects of environmental protection can best be gained at the EU level - such as in the area of agricultural subventions, opposition to free trade agreements with America and so on. Most of us want a more loosely structured EU, and the Greens are no different here. You say that we are deluded if we think the EU can change - all it means is changing just over 700 MEPs in Brussels which can change it any time - but won't change as long as people go on thinking that the Euro elections are unimportant compared to National ones, and only about a third of the electorate turn up - all this does is produce distorted results.
Seems as if things became a bit heated along the line here today. Watching what has happened all over Europe, it sometimes seems to be forgotten that the elections took place in countries other than just UK and France, there have been protests aimed at respective governments. President Francois Hollande who seems to be trying to win the prize for the most unpopular leader on record received a right kicking. Yet where did the votes go? There was a detailed list of candidates and the votes cast for them in the newspaper that covers the south west. The FN did not benefit greatly and the small parties such as Abertzaleen Batasunahe the Basque Nationalist party received no votes at all. In the lead up to the election the ex-President Sarkosy was calling for a less centralized EU, with powers being returned to national governments. His message was heard as many people returned to the UMP party candidates. One again it was the large cities where there are many problems who voted for the FN, yet strangely UKIP made little headway in London.
The anti-Eu parties who have been elected still form a small group in the parliament, but if they bother to turn up and vote they could create some changes. Yes they have been elected and do have to speak for the electors who sent them there. The feeling here is that the FN will have far larger problems trying to act as a mainstream party than they did while they simply turned up enough to claim the allowance and put out anti EU propaganda. I guess progress will be slow, but changes will come about because mainstream politicians realize that people vote against what happens in their country, not for the much larger picture of what happens in Europe.
The anti-Eu parties who have been elected still form a small group in the parliament, but if they bother to turn up and vote they could create some changes. Yes they have been elected and do have to speak for the electors who sent them there. The feeling here is that the FN will have far larger problems trying to act as a mainstream party than they did while they simply turned up enough to claim the allowance and put out anti EU propaganda. I guess progress will be slow, but changes will come about because mainstream politicians realize that people vote against what happens in their country, not for the much larger picture of what happens in Europe.
Hello oldfrenchhorn 
I like voters in your country because they haven't got their head up their arse
I like voters in your country because they haven't got their head up their arse
Hello oldfrenchhorn
I like voters in your country because they haven't got their head up their arse
Are you suggesting then that the ones who voted in the UK did then?
Looking around Europe Frenchie it appears that all of those countries which had large 'protest' votes also had very low electoral turnouts. Get all of your supporters to the polling booths with a low turnout and anything can happen. The end result is that we have over a hundred MEPs from UKIP all earning on average 7000 Euros per month sitting in an institution which they do not agree with, voting on nothing and getting paid European tax payers money for it. What people forget is that this so called 'political earthquake' in England amounted to 27% of the 34% who actually bothered to vote - in other words about 9% of the electorate as a whole. Maybe we need compulsory voting as in Belgium.
Hello oldfrenchhorn
I like voters in your country because they haven't got their head up their arse
Because they voted for the Front National? Anyway, earlier in this thread you claimed that you should not criticise others for their political views. Changed your tune a bit now I see
If the UK leaves the EU will I be able to choose between an EU passport or a UK one. Come to that if Scotland gets independence will I be able to choose between a UK passport and a Scottish one, though I have no connexion with Scotland other than it is part do the country for which I hold nationality?
I really don't want to lose my EU passport.
I really don't want to lose my EU passport.
Perhaps you could - according to you most of the electorate hate the country so it might be time to go somewhere else. Like France.............
yorkshirehornet
Well-Known Member
yorkshirehornet
Well-Known Member
http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-cant-change-economic-system-our-number-is-up
A damning article on the folly of growth and its implications for our biosphere.......
A damning article on the folly of growth and its implications for our biosphere.......
Problem is Yorkie, all of the real growth will come from the developing and third world as their aspirations grow from mere survival to personal growth - this is where the real growth in consumerism will be. But this artical does not really address this and it's an area kept well clear of by the politicians - which politician would dare raise this. But as these countries break free from the shakels of poverty this is where there will be the growth.