A comparison of the two teams that came 2nd. 2009 on left. 2014 on right Goalkeepers: Reina > Mignolet * Verdict: Rafa's 2009 team better goalkeeper. Reina was at his best in 2009. Mignolet was good but a shade beneath. Defenders: Arbeloa > Johnson Insua < Flannagan Dossenna > Cissoko Aurelio = Enrique - no verdict since Enrique too injured! Aurelio injured a lot too. When not injured Enrique probably better. Skrtel < Skrtel Agger > Agger Carragher > Sakho Hyypia > Toure *Verdict: Rafa's 2009 team had a better defensive set up. Full backs was a sore point for both squads Midfield * Note comparing Gerrard of today to Mash of then- not himself because in different role now Lucas > Lucas Mash > Gerrard Alonso > Allen Gerrard > Henderson * Verdict: Rafa's 2009 squad had one of the best midfield in the world at the time. The best Midfield I've seen in recent memory with Liverpool. Definitely 2009. Forwards/Attacking/Wingers * Due to Rodger's tactics- and making it easier to compare lumping all these together Kuyt < Sterling Torres < Suarez Keane < Sturridge Babel > Moses Riera < Coutinho N'Gog > Aspas * Verdict Rodgers more attack minded players were far better than Rafa's 2009 team and it's this that sets them apart. Overall, I think Rodger's team of 2014 did very admirably to finish 2nd- and are a team that will improve with time- whereas Rafa's team of 2009 were a team of players, who were already at, or close to their peaks. They were probably the best team in the league in 2009 and let themselves down. Rodger's team of 2014 is probably not as good- but certainly more exciting. We know what happened in 2010. 2015 is more optimistic, assuming Suarez doesn't leave. Many players in the squad who will continue to the next season are going to improve with time.
Rafa's team was better and let themselves down as you say. Rodger's team were an utter surprise to everyone, including me. I've quoted many times 'the smart take from the strong' concept and that applies to Rodger's team this past season.
Combined First XI: -------------------------------------- REINA (09) --------------------------------------- ARBELOA (09) ------ CARRAGHER (09) ------ AGGER (09) ---------- FLANNY (14) ------------------------------------- MASH (09) ----------------------------------------- ------------------------ ALONSO (09) ------- GERRARD (09) -------------------------- ----------STURRIDGE (14) ----------------------------- SUAREZ (14) ------------------ ----------------------------------- TORRES (09) ----------------------------------------- Subs: MIGS (14); SKRTEL (14); AGGER (14); HENDERSON (14); KUYT (09); STERLING (14); LUCAS (09);
Rafa '05 VS Rodgers '14 Comparing the Istanbul team to us now... Goalkeeper Dudek < Migs * Do the Dudek- but keep Migs as the keeper Defenders Finan > Johnson Riise > Flannagan Traore > Cissoko Hyypia > Skrtel Carragher > Sakho Pellegrino < Toure * Easy win for Rafa '05 for defenders. Hyyia still at peak- and Carragher was great. Midfield * Note comparing Gerrard of today to Hamann of then- not himself because in different role now Biscan < Lucas * momentary insanity... I meant to put Biscan better lol! Hamann = Gerrard * I can't call a verdict on this. Great season for Gerrard- but it was a great season for the Kaiser too! Alonso > Allen Gerrard > Henderson Smicer < Coutinho * Verdict: I'm going with a slight 2005 victory in Midfield. I think the starting Midfield in 2005 was superior but 2014 had better depth. Forwards/Wingers Garcia < Sterling Cisse < Suarez Baros < Sturridge Kewell > Moses Pongolle > Aspas * Verdict: Clear victory for Rodger's 2014 squad. Overall: Despite better defenders, and first team midfielders- 2014's much better forward line up and vastly improved goalkeeper means that they win overall against the 2005 team.
Combined First XI: (05 and 14) -------------------------------------- MIGS (14) --------------------------------------- FINNAN (05) ------ CARRAGHER (05) ------ HYYPIA (05) ------------ RIISE (05) ------------------------------------- HAM (05) ----------------------------------------- ------------------- ALONSO(05) ------- GERRARD (05) -------------------------- ----------------------------------- STERLING (14) ------------------------------------- ----------------------- SUAREZ (14) ------ STURRIDGE (14) ------------------------- Subs: KEWELL (05) SKRTEL (14) SAKHO (14) FLANNY (14) GERRARD(14) HENDERSON(14) CISSE(05)
Rafas was better but the current strike force is slightly better. Also truth be told, your striker force back then was Gerrard and Torres. The others in Rafas squad were terrible. This should demonstrate just how quickly you can fall off if you dont address the weak spots. rafa went from 2nd to 7th a year later. Didnt address the issues and lost the plot.
i dont remember rafa being able to address the issue to be fair, thought it was because he had the piss taken by the owners and had to sell to buy first when we had just come 2nd and had no transfer budget! might be wrong, but be interesting to see how much he had to spend that season.
I dont think he would have done anyway. He was pretty poor in the market. Torres was good and there were a few others but so much random spanish dross. No wonder spain did so well recently..... rafa removed all the ****e
It's a real worry when you see Traore > anyone And the fact you then changed your mind and made today's Lucas better than Biscan discounts everything else you've said unfortunately
rafa was linked to some quality players before the rest of Europe took notice of them, so your rafa bashing is laughable considering what he was working with owners wise. we could have had some quality players if it wasn't for bull **** at board level going on.
Maybe the worlds footballers took notice of Rafa falling apart rather embarrassingly that season and thought better of it? Bit of both I would think.
Reina, Torres, Alonso, Masherano, Skrtel, Lucas, Kuyt, Johnson (he was good for a few years) - Rafa made a lot of purchases for Liverpool that were excellent signings... even today- our squad still has a lot of players that was there in the Rafa era... they haven't been improved upon yet. He made a bunch of rubbish signings too... especially in wing back positions. Rafa spent a lot of money- but never a lot on individual players. I'm not sure if that was a Rafa decision- quantity over quality- or if the board always restricted him from paying too much on any individual... based on Rafa's comments, it sounds like the board wouldn't let him buy who he wanted and made him spread the money around thinner on more risky signings. Cissoko is the only player in the world that Traore is better than. Yeah... don't know why I did that. Everyone knows Biscan is a legend... momentary insanity perhaps.
If the board gave Rafa the money he wanted, rather than being forced to sell to buy, he would have bought Silva, Alves, Negredo and Villa long before they became such household names. Probably others, but those four always spring to my mind as players he wanted but couldn't afford. With the defense and midfield we had, we would have had an incredible attack too with Torres already here. Of course Rafa made blunders in the market like all managers do, but he could identify talent all day long too.
Under Rafa we were linked with Aguero for a while too! Kun and his father-in-law, Maradonna, were big admirers of Rafa's Liverpool.
f me... that is a huge insutl to aspas... it says something that anyone could think the useless n'dog is better than anyone but there you go... utterly shocking yet possibly true
the reality is rafa f'd himself over keane that year and it was feb after he left we fell off the cliff.
Reina (09) Arbeloa (09) - Carragher (09) - Agger (09) - Flanno (14) Mascherano (09) - Alonso (09) Gerrard (09) Suarez (14) - - - - - - - - - - - Sterling (14) Torres (09)
Same GD. 25 goals less in each department. 2009 was a stronger team, if less inspired. Back then we were hit by the fact that we drew a lot of lousy games. OP has Riera v Coutinho. That tells you the 09 team was lacking that creative AM that weasels through the channels.
I like Rodgers more than Rafa. Rafa stifled creativity. Many of us ask what Rafa would have done if he got the funds to make his purchases but to be honest I see what UIR is saying . I remember when he got the funds to purchase Keane, then got frustrated when Keane started to score (an offensive player not focusing on defensive duties? Nonsense) and sold him back for a loss 6 months later (18m in, 14m out). Or spending 20m on Aquilani who didn't do anything of note. 11 on Babel. 7 on Dossena. 7 on Pennant. 6 on Morientes. In the markets of 2005-10 those sums were not insignificant and had he not wasted those funds perhaps our owners would have put up a little more later. He was 50/50 and unfortunately I would not trust huge sums of money to someone who is likely to lose it half the time. Rodgers is 50/50 right now too but it isn't costing us as much compared to our relative income/the market trend. His biggest flops were free while the unsuccessful ones have drastically improved this season (Borini). I don't want to see more Allen's and Sahin's (though I feel Nuri was misused in favour of Allen). I'd probably want Hyypïa in, Arbeloa in, Insúa in (2008 wonderkid Insua), Torres, Masch, and Alonso. But I'm happy about the future more than I was then. 08/09 we never had the title in our hands in the run-up. Even the Arsenal game wouldn't have been enough.
Think our 09 team was better and was fighting on more than 1 front. However this years team probably came closer to winning the title. Always the ****ing nearly men.
