While the voting is voluntary then labour and the Tories have got politics sowed up with their party faithfuls who do vote. Its the majority of the population that cant be bothered to vote are the ones who make sure that the country will always be run by one or the other and that is why you never see either labour or tory making voting compulsory as they know the would suffer greatly...You will see throughout the past elections that mid term or bye elections are nearly always protest votes but when the main election comes around they go back as a party faithful because labour voters don't want the tories in power and vice versa. Its the people who don't vote are the ones to blame for politics to be a closed shop between just two parties... All the smaller parties cant muster enough votes to even make a dent in stopping the big two from governing the country...
Make voting compulsory while also having "None of the above"? Another problem is education. There is no political education in the UK. Most see it as a bore and some are too thick to know what to vote for and are easily manipulated. The establishment want the masses dumb.
I think Nigel is a great orator and he speaks very well and is right on a lot of things but we never get to hear about any important stuff that effects everyone and their livelihood to do with the country. What about education, taxes, nhs and the rest of the things that make this country tick. He forgets that we refused to join the euro and still use the pound. Look Brussels is not perfect by a long way but its better than trying to go it alone as most of whats left in industry is owned by foreign Investors who bailed us out. We have nothing to trade with of our own anymore and if we pull out of the EU then these foreign Investors will leave in droves and apart from those employed by them losing their jobs other local small businesses will go bust who rely on EU substancy and it will continue down the chain to your local shop as more and more families wont be able to afford things like they use too. We needs Europe by our side just to survive at the end of the day because this country has been torn apart by previous governments who are millionaires themselves and are out of touch with the real situation. We already have food banks springing up everywhere as it is without making things worse ditching the mouth that feeds us. Nigel has some good points but to pull out of Europe is not the answer and what we need is to be far stronger in Europe and negotiate for a better deals than we have at present. Nigel used to be a tory and if he was to stop these silly ideas that we would be better off out of Europe and come back to the real world then he would be just the man to fight our corner in Brussels. Its not perfect but its better than nothing and losing everything that Europe helps us with...
"We have nothing to trade with of our own anymore" Plenty of manufacturing industry still in the UK, and 'trade' also covers financial services in which London is a world leader. Lots of countries to trade with, particularly the developing ones like India, China and Brasil whose growth rates put the developed countries to shame. Europe not only buys from us but we also buy huge amounts in from Europe. I don't think they'll want to stop that do you? "if we pull out of the EU then these foreign Investors will leave in droves" Not with one of the lowest corporation tax rates in the Western world they won't. "Its not perfect but its better than nothing and losing everything that Europe helps us with... " Does that include the £50M a day membership fee? "Better than nothing" is inaccurate because it shows a shoulder-shrug mentality and is effectively saying there's no alternative, but that's simply not true. Norway isn't in the EU but is a members of the European Free Trade Area so they freely trade with Europe. Don't believe the big parties' spin on job losses either. Companies know which side their bread is buttered on and the UK has a lot to offer in terms of a skilled workforce and low tax rates.
Dragon dont be so naive the amount of major businesses could never support the whole country. we wont last 5 minutes on our own anymore...
Its £53m a day by the way but you dont seem to understand that they all put money into the fund. We get a lot more back in funding our industries that are left plus road rail shipping and many many other things that the EU help with funding. There are thousands of small companies that rely on EU funding....Its up to us to get a better deal and that's where we are weak...
I do agree that the one thing that can save the Tories on Europe is if a wholesale renegotiation is pulled off. Can't see it happening.
David Cameron just like tony Blair have IMO been the worst prime ministers in recent times and have not done enough in the European parliament to give the British public the best deal possible, they and their like have lost touch with reality and don't understand the true meaning of living in poverty. I wish both parties had someone like Nigel in the cabinet who can speak up for the British people and get us a better deal in Europe.....Im a long term socialist and i cant stand the way both tory and labour have sold us down the river but pulling out of the EU would be a disaster because today the working man relies on the EU indirectly and otherwise for a living. Sadly and the reality is that we cant afford not to be in the EU...
Having been in the Pension Industry Gendros I can tell you your pension is not safe, both Labour and Tory would love to escalate their pick pocketing of the pension funds that they have done over the years, but I'm pleased for you that you have a nest egg, make sure you look after it, because you will be the last of a generation to enjoy such pension benefits, your children and grand children won't see anything of the like, as they are the ones who will be picking up the tab for all the miss management of so many Labour and Tory Governments over the years and as Dai has so correctly stated both parties have sold the working class short badly, we are a country that has been so badly managed over the years, every asset has been sold off, and it started in the 70's with Steel and Gas, it's all about taking from the poor and giving to the rich, always has been always will be, until this racket is broken!.................. By the way Gendros how are you banned? am I talking to myself here? or is it a mistake.
"pulling out of the EU would be a disaster because today the working man relies on the EU indirectly and otherwise for a living. Sadly and the reality is that we cant afford not to be in the EU..." Sorry but this is a propagandised myth perpetuated by powerful people with vested interests in the status quo. No, not the band. Again, you are coming at it from an angle of there not being an alternative and it's just not true.
Its not a myth at all. We cannot now live a decent life without the EU's financial input. Its not perfect by any stretch of the imagination but as we have got rid of most of our industries and what is left have been privatized where European investors are now in control everywhere you look then what have we got that will sustain a decent living for everyone. We don't even own some of the water,gas,electricity companies for gods sake. You will be surprised how little Britain owns now. At least in the EU we have some sort of protection, You can see how bad things are today with living standards dropping like nobodies business, can you imagine if we left the EU we would be at the mercy of these foreign owners who can do what they like and increase services when ever they like. It would be absolutely suicide to even contemplate leaving the EU today. Will the millionaires suffer? Of course they wont but the rest of us will suffer the consequences if we do pull out...
Indeed. For example substantial EU funds have been used to fund urban regeneration projects throughout the UK. Birmingham have benefited greatly, and there's various other places throughout the UK who have received funds. T The EU may not be perfect, it may cost us a lot of money but it's ridiculous to focus on the cons of Europe while completely ignoring the benefits. One of my problems with UKIP and Farage is that they can't see anything right with the EU, while my problem with the Lib Dems and Clegg is that they can't see anything wrong. Both the vehemently pro and the vehemently anti-EU views are neither helpful nor conducive to reasonable debate, nor does it give people the opportunity to make an informed choice. But hey, that's what politicians are all about....
This is a common misconception. The eu is not going to just stop all trade with the uk because we decide to pull out of the eu. Eu countries have more to lose than we do from cutting ties with the uk. Any attempt to leave the eu would be on the condition of continued trade agreements, which is in the best interests of both parties. It would also open the door for new trade deals with other countries around the world which whilst in the eu we are unable to do. Many forecasts expect the price of living in the uk would go down if we pulled out of the eu, particularly items like food. The huge fees paid towards the eu could instead be used to pull us back to economic recovery at a much quicker rate than other European countries, giving us the edge over them. Pulling out of the eu opens many opportunities for the uk and could help us become the strongest European economy once again.
Is anyone else bothered by Nigel Farage's "down the pub, man of the people" image? Man of the people my arse. Why is it that the two politicians I dislike the most who are launching two referendums I disagree with the most effective politicians in the country atm? God the leadership of the big three are useless.
You're concentrating on personalities. Who gives a **** about what coat he wears? Somebody earlier said they didn't like it afctw is correct. The statement "We cannot now live a decent life without the EU's financial input." is incredibly naive. No offence. Norway has the highest standard of living the world because they benefit from the Free Trade Agreement without having the crippling bills of membership that means richer countries pay more. Of course we've had inward investment from the EU but we put in a lot more than we get out and this trend will continue as poorer countries are propped up by the richer ones as they join. The BBC did a programme on it recently and whilst Portugal is a basket case that's being crippled by paying off its bailout, EU money is pouring into Poland where business is booming. We are headed towards a lopsided Europe if we haven't done so already. Farage ripped Blair a new one years ago on this very issue: "Why should the British tax payer have to pay for new sewers in Budapest and for a new underground system in Warsaw when our own public services are crumbling in London?" Fair point! All Blair can do is respond with vitriol about UKIP. No answers at all. 9 years ago and nothing changes. [video=youtube;l5v92kCBy7c]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5v92kCBy7c[/video]
http://anotherangryvoice.blogspot.co.uk/2014/05/ukip-censorship-facebook-aav.html Are UKIP really 'anti-establishment'?
Hmmmm.... that's a card they play a lot I think because they know the public are pretty cheesed off with mainstream politicians. As for that blog, well I can understand UKIP's annoyance to be honest though I can't see why the police would be involved. Trouble is with bloggers is that they can repeat misinformation and say it was nothing to do with them. Fact is the original blog was by a Green Party candidate who did a spoof UKIP manifesto and put it online. The thing is it actually looked genuine and even had UKIP's logos on it. The material contained such things as a pledge to make rape legal within marriage and of course none of it was true. Mark my words, as the election nears the smears against UKIP by the establishment will intensify, but that doesn't mean I don't have issues with them. They are against gay marriage and that concerns me, but I'm beginning to think that any party that can deliver a massive boot up the arse to the established parties will be very popular and I predict they'll landslide the upcoming elections.
