I don't care how good a player is, if he's pushed you into a corner and opted to join a fierce rival, you don't take them back. It'd be like us having Torres (but still decent) back
Yeah but we can see the irony, but when oxo takes his foot out of his mouth and shakes his head he might realise that, as it stands he's happy to win nothing, fill their owners pockets, make up the CL numbers and have a 1 in 4 chance of winning the Emirates Cup every summer.
But that's the key, Wenger says top 4 is as good as a trophy, the legions of goons swallow it, Wenger then professes to have Brewster's in the kitty and then gets an injured journeyman on loan.
Yeah, calling fourth a trophy is a bit cringy and I won't be happy if Brod says that (although it wouldn't surprise me). IMO, we need to get top four for two or three seasons running before building further. I know our current team isn't a millions miles away from the top ATM but that's more to do with no European football. Come next season (assuming we get top four) we'll have more games to contend with. With a already thin squad, we'll need quantity come the summer so the quality coming in may suffer.
rodgers stated today on sky interview with carragher he didn't expect to be in the mix for 4th this year. he also talks about our expectations. I think he still has to realise just how big a job he's got sometimes. However on the other hand i simply cannot believe how little wenger has done in the past 8 years and i do wonder if he too realises just how big a jobs he's got and what he is meant to deliver. he's won two doubles yet he doesn't seem to think he needs to deliver even a sniff of a cup. neither man will be looking at anything but this next game. I just think arsenal look more solid and less liable to give up chances. hopefully it'll be close. i would have taken a draw v everton so perhaps LFc will surprise again who knows.
That bit is in a fans perspective, not a club owners view. Whether you like it or not, football is a business nowadays and money is all that matters to these guys. That means top four IS more important than a cup win. Sad really but that's reality unfortunately.
well yeah wenger has delivered upon business requirements over time. he is reliable. anything else = a risk... just like utd. but you have to back your club to attract a big name in europe if you are always there or thereabouts. england's 3rd most successful ever club is likely to always be that or worse over the next years. I fancy chelsea and/or city to pass them by over the next decade.. chelsea have a bit to go to overhaul arsenal's historic titles and fa cups.. quite a bit but as the third most successful club i just don't get why they seem to the outsider to be so blase about winning. Us.... i absolutely go mad when fans talk like this... but we were nearly bankrupted and 3 years of doldrums has knocked the arse out of some of us. BUt are arsenal fans so used to nothing they don't care? in any event... nobody from the press to the public at large think arsenal can win the league this year. that says it all. I'll take the draw right now please.
I think it depends on the player. Some are obviously driven by money but lets ignore them here. There are two other things that players want that both come under ambition; to wins things and/or to play in the CL. Arsenal are regulars in the latter and are therefore able to offer that. They are a big club so there is always a chance of the former too. I talk about us sacrificing the cup competitions for us to concentrate on fourth for progressive reasons. CL football attracts better players and brings more money into the club too. This builds a platform for the club to progress to a position where we will be better placed to challenge for more honours. again, I think this ambition can be seen in two ways; immediate success such as a cup or long term success that see's us challenge for three cups and the league.
I honestly do not think personally "playing in the champions league" is the reason players move. I honestly don't. eg. eriksen. could sit at ajax and play CL. I think they want the big club and the big wage. this comes with CL. YOu should move to win **** like the CL or get rich. Arsenal don't just offer CL also ran status to players they offer f'n huge wages. here's a decent article http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/apr/18/premier-league-finances-club-by-club arsenal are 4th in wages in 2012 (awaiting 2013 accounts) at 143 mil.. out of 245mil turnover. LFC were 5th in wages and have actively tried to reduce our wages... ergo aspas IMO. we paid 119mil wages out of 169mil.. so reality check pay aquilani 100k he'll come. offer him 50 no chance. Cheslea, utd and city top the charts. the others think city have broken FFP with thier wages alone and there will be creative accounting to account for it. The only people who can stop this is the tax man that get the accounts and force them to report properly for tax. uefa won't do it.. see sunday supplement this morning. for me..... arsenal don't offer CL. they offer huge wages and potentially a stepping stone to even bigger ones and the club that will go for medals. RVP, Kelb , nasri, the list of gooners leaving for even better clubs is long. so..... LFC need to offer the wages by building the revenue. end of story. the CL on its won won't allow us to match these wages. its that simple.
I agree players should aim to win things but there are only so many trophies to go around so not everyone can achieve that. Good point with Eriksen (and Suarez) with Ajax and CL football. Perhaps I should have said "play in the best competitions" rather than CL though since they both moved to a vastly superior (in term of quality) league. PS...I did say I wanted to ignore the wages bit
I don't think you can. i think its all baout the money... i mean they all want the easy ride too. you can't offer a maybe plus 100k these days you have to offer a you will and here's 150k. so someone like lukaku is basically wasting his time at cheslea. is he playing CL, no. is he winning things... no. so whats he doing? taking big wages playing on loan for 3 years. next years the ski's buy two 50mil stikers and there he is wasting his time again. salah has gone there and is cup tied for CL yeah? so he'll bench warm this year and prob next year and collect his big wages. why do players go to galatasaray? or russia? big money. they'd rather that than CL and ajax or basel or wherever. tex free riches... nice. players with ambition like a sturridge seem rare. I eman credit to mata he could sit at chavland on the bench no probs but he wants to play and be the guy.
Jesus, talk about an anti-Arsenal circle jerk As to the whole why are Arsenal fans so blasé about winning cups thing, it's mainly because we're so jaded of it all, the continual implosions and near misses, 2006 Paris, 07/08 eduardo/gallas debacle, Brummiegate 2011 etc, combined with the several seasons in which we've surmounted all odds in finishing in the top 4 (lasagnagate, fulopgate, #negativespiral), means that it truly feels like we have accomplished something when we've scraped top 4, and felt optimistic for the next season (well in the past anyway) as we were always promised that big signings would come. There were always young players coming through, who would come good 'next year' etc., so it felt like every year we finished top 4 might herald something better in terms of signings etc. Inevitably, our better players would leave, and we would again have to rebuild (Signing young players), and console ourselves that if we finished top 4 with this lot (of kids), then the next year they would be better, and we could push on with one or two signings. Unfortunately, due to the timing of the stadium construction, this never really happened. So eventually, top 4 just became this goal (or 'trophy' if you like), that symbolised better times in the future. (because god forbid we didn't finish in the top 4, we would have no money for signings whatsoever). Luckily, we seem to have come out of the economic pain to an extent, and are finally catching up on our woeful commercial deals, so people are starting to believe again in winning trophies, and top 4 will stop being so much of an achievement. In terms of the wages argument, I think Arsenal are one of the few clubs that includes non-playing staff in its wage bill, and since we chopped out most of our deadwood I don't think our wages will be that high now. Back to the game, I would have high hopes for us, even for this run in, if we had our 2 best players fit (Ramsey and Walcott), as well as our defensive lynchpin (Flamini). Without them, we're really going to struggle, obviously I'm hoping for a double win over you lot, but I'm thinking it'll be a win at your place for us, but a draw at home (possibly a loss if Wenger puts out a weakened team to rest for our match against Bayern). I'd be delighted with 7 pts and an FA cup win, with a loss in the Champions League, would be satisfied with 5 pts, an FA cup win and Champions league 3-0 drubbing, but I;m expecting 5 pts, an FA cup draw/loss and Champions league loss, because I can't imagine Wenger putting a second team out against Bayern and the first team against liverpool.
Liverpool are such certainties for this match that Arsenal might as well not even show up. The likes of Henderson, Gerrard and Coutinho will pass the likes of Ozil, Cazorla and Arteta off the park. And with the superior Toure brother, looking like an absolute colossus in defence, I struggle to see how Arsenal can even score. I'm going for a 4-0 win for Liverpool in this
well i'm glad you so sensible arsenal fans turned up and told us all how crap your club is and how glad you will be when we put you out of your misery. i can't imagine how hard it is to run so close and just feel so certain its all about to fall in around your ears... i'm sure a good thumping will be a blessed relief to you poor boys. of course you could offer us a 0+ £1 - 0 tie breaker for the 3 points.
King Shergar is a Manc mate Mito was talking to the Arsenal fan I think Shergar is also only doing this as Sisu and I have been on their match threads saying how they will walk a game and seemingly jinxing them so its fair game really
