Gay Footballers

Yes, but that's not really what I'd consider a hateful song, its pretty much the same one we have for the luftwaffe.
But that's what I mean, players have to develop a thick skin, and although in all honesty I can imagine many people chanting about a players sexuality, it wouldn't be hateful vitriol, but rather just another weapon to use to antagonise a player and get them banned for 2 games <cough>wilshere<cough>
And for the first time in quite a while, we could point at a player that has come out and KNOW that they have truly acted as a great role model, because as soon as one superstar comes out as gay, much of a generation will understand that it is acceptable in todays society, and suicidal teenage homesexuals (unfortunately of which there are many), may start to believe that they're not so different after all.

 

Good points all!

We need to grow up as a society and take a more grown up attitude to sex. Sexual activity needs to be considered off-limits, in exactly the same way that race and religion are. Chants about players and managers being gay, or ****s, should be as offensive as religious or racial slurs.

 

Seeing as i started this flame war I think i should answer some

Coming out is not only for many people to say they are gay, but to accept who they are as many are told from a young age being gay is wrong or abnormal for many it is a way to accept who they are not necessarily for the benefit of the public but mostly for themselves. Also coming out is a way of saying that you don't have to hide who you are it is a way of telling the world this is who I am.

With toledo on this you have reiterated his statement and agree with him but then call him a plank for having the same opinion. Think with him on your ignore list you accidently quoted the wrong person

You do realise statements like this is what drives gay people to fear coming out, drives many to suicide and hide who they are leading lives of confusion and sadness. Piskie you ask why people come out. Well its to tell these people to f**k off and let them be. Its to say I dont have to hide my life so you can be happy with not knowing something that doesn't affect you but your archaic f**ked up beliefs.

Amen!!!!

 

I think it's a bit patronising to say that it's a way for people to accept who they are, although I understand where you're coming from. There is still a huge stigma around being Gay, and telling the world that you are Gay can be a self-empowering move, but the bigger point here is that gay people shouldn't have to 'come-out' to seek acceptance. Ultimately it shouldn't matter at all, it's somebody's private sex life and it's got **** all to do with anybody else.

 

Its really not, its something I have heard from many different people who have come out. To many it very empowering and see it as the last stage of accepting themselves and their place in the world. I agree with you the ideal is that it shouldn't matter. But that is far removed from the reality.

 

"Well its to tell these people to f**k off and let them be......."


thats exactly what they were doing ....till he made it public, now they may not .

No one needed to know my sexual preferences , why do i need to know his ?

 

exactly .

Not acceptance by the rest of us .........?

But themselves.

 

Maybe patronising is a bit strong a term to use, but overall and although some gay people will say it's an empowering thing to do, it's still an act based largely on the acceptance of others rather than some internalised context. But I agree that the ideal and the reality are still some way apart.

 

Let them be may not be the best choice of the words there. More like **** you and your homophobia I am going to be who I am in spite of what your beliefs and views are and however may it may effect your sensibilities.

 

I disagree here. Yes it is a way to tell people who you are and open up your self to love or condemnation for being you. But it is very much an internalised thing the biggest decision a person makes when they come out is they are no longer going to live a lie, they are not going to hide who they are anymore. It is about having faith in you, if you have to cover it up its because you feel you will be judged and cannot cope/may get hurt. Coming out is saying reggardless I will no longer hide myself. Yes you obviously want the love and respect of those you care for when you do come out. But that not the motivation of coming out, thats more the post fact effect you hope to get.

Maybe we have to attribute a difference between a normal coming out and a celebrity doing it. But that really is the motivation from all I have heard.

 

Only a Gay person can answer that honestly.

But the act of 'coming out' is in the context of seeking acceptance due to prejudice, when ultimately it shouldn't matter.

You wouldn't tell the world that you're straight, because it's widely accepted. But coming to terms with your own sexuality is the key issue here, regardless of what way that leans. The fact that it has to be announced if you are Gay is directly as a result of defiance of the prejudice.

 

This post would (I think) be considered borderline offensive by a lot of gay-people.

The don't ask, don't tell situation, and the "Well, it is their own fault for telling people they are gay" line, just aren't acceptable any more. Just as the, "Well, my religious views say that I have to hate them" doesn't go very far either.

I don't know how old you are, but for an old fella like me, I found it really hard to understand the nuances of the argument why, so although I know that these are not acceptable, I am not going to try and explain it here. Someone else can have a go if they want.

 

This is coming from many gay people I know. . But the defiance plays very much into the theme of acceptance. It is the stage where you not only defy but you fully accept that you are who you are in spite of the prejudice.

I will grant that maybe this stage will no longer be prevalent once prejudice doesn't exist (when will it not) so i don't disagree with your end game. Just more the reality of it from what I have seen first hand (my cousin) and been told by many.

 

I presume you are straight. So my argument will follow from that.

Because your sexuality is the norm because everyone is considered straight untill they say otherwise. Like Piskie said you create a world where the prejudice stops and people will no longer need to come out they will just be. You create a world where you will not be judged for it, religions will not deem you a sinner, it won't be illegall for you to get married, to live, to exist because of who you are. To be denied the rights others are entitled to just because you are being yourself . You want have people hate you for being yourself. The issue of coming out wont exist.

Change the word to sexuality to race, religion, creed, caste and hopefully you will see how bigoted that sounds. It is the same as going to the Blacks during the civil rights movement and saying I am white and don't go on about it why are you going on about being black.

 

Not really because Blacks were persecuted because it was obvious they were black , theres no issue of " dont ask dont tell "

The player in question has NOT been persecuted at all .

Has he . ?

If he now wants to tell everyone hes gay , thats great .

Big deal ,
Unless he wants a medal or course .
Well , i dont get a medal for being straight .
Why should he get one .
He wants to be treated equally .
Fine , welcome to the world .
I dont care about homosexuality in the slightest .
But lets not say hes some kind of martyr.
Hes not , hes just a bloke that likes blokes .

Big whoop .

 

better call Lambeth council , im sure they will have a department with a HUUUUUGE budget to investigate it .

 

As far as i'm concerned, if a player is good, and improves the team, i don't care if he's gay, straight, bisexual, or an alien, just as long as he's good.

 

this!!!!!!!

 

I am black and I hate it when some people say gays are like being black. You made that choice you can eat apples or you can eat pears. I like women but I can choose not to sleep with them and just live on my own(sometime not by choice) but me being black well am just black not a choice!
Look people can do what they want, I believe in God so who am I to tell anyone what to do with their life only God can judge you and my opinion is the word of God is the truth and human beings will never know or understand the capabilities of God our creator so we should not question God just be cool love one other and try and get on while we are here,
life is so short believe me the only thing guaranteed in life is death!

 

The thing that's the most surprising for me is that he's only 31 years old! It's like he's been around forever, playing for Villa during our pre and invincible era, and he's still, only 31!