Everything Alf says is true, that Toby fella is a knob, Alf is always ripping him a new'un on general chat
If you were paying a transfer fee for him then you'll be paying a loan fee, the same as we did when signed Boyd from P'boro last season. I'd be surprised if you weren't paying a fee since we recalled him from Charlton to send him to you and tried to get them to outbid you. If you weren't paying a fee why wouldn't we just leave him with them for the whole season so that they were covering his wages right to the end of his contract? That said, you'll be getting him cheaper now the clubs have realised he can't play every game for you. Here's another genuine discussion for you though, if you're signing him he can only join you for a total of 93 days. Those 93 days don't have to be consecutive though, you're allowed to split the loan up into chunks. The only rules you need to consider are: 1) Each chunk has to be a minimum of 28 days long. 2) No chunk can start in the first 7 days after the January transfer window closes (the EM loan window opens a week later every time) 3) The last chunk has to start on (or before) 27th March as the emergency loan window closes that day. (Up to and including the last league game of the season that's 38 of your 93 days used unless you're happy to lose him before then) That means you can, to some extent, pick which games he'll be unavailable for, so when would be best? And do you arrange them to include potential playoff games, reducing the chances of him helping you get there, but giving you a better chance once you are? *Technically during the breaks in the loan he'd return to us, but there's nothing to stop him training with you, like I said earlier it's the way we signed Boyd last season.
Josh,was thinking the same. OK daft question time can we sign an emergency loan(never really understood that save a team having no keepers) In the transfer window? My guess is no,but these rules do seem a bit twisted.
It is, but as it's rarely publicised a club has done it not many fans are aware of it, I mean as another example, until last season with Watford how many people knew that foreign loans didn't count as loans in your matchday squad? PL clubs have been exploiting it for years, when we first got to the PL in 2008 we had 3 loan players on the pitch most of the time despite only being allowed 2 because we had Zayatte on loan from a foreign club so he didn't count. We also that season signed King and Gardner on loan early in the window which was our maximum of 2 for that window, then because we wanted to sign McShane as well made Gardner's move permanent because then they ignore the fact he was ever on loan. Past examples: QPR with Tommy Smith - they tried to sign him permanently in the August but didn't get the paperwork in in time. So they signed him on 3 seperate emergency loans starting in September with a permanent in January, but announced it as a single loan covering the whole time ahead of a permanent move. Us with George Boyd - we announced about 100 days before the playoff final last season that we'd signed him on loan (had to be an emergency loan as it was after the transfer deadline) and that he would be available for the playoff final should we get to Wembley. (so we have to have broken it down) There'll be loads more that I'm just not aware of. Yes, an emergency loan can be signed any time (allowing for the rules I'll give below). I'll give you a quick run through the two types of loan (so apologies to people who don't care), so you can see why we have emergency loans (as far as I know we're the only country that has them). Long term loans When the transfer window system came in certain rules applied to loan deals. Just to be confusing a long term loan deal can be any length, and between any two clubs in the world. If you want to sign a player on a long term loan deal you have to sign them during either the summer or January transfer window because it classes as a temporary transfer rather than a loan as far as FIFA are concerned, and that means the player's registration is transferred to you. The loan can end any time the teams agree to it ending, but because the registration is with the club he was loaned to, he can't play for his parent club until they are next in a transfer window. So for example If in July you loan a player to Bradford to get some games and the deal is due to end in January it will be a long term loan. Even if both clubs and the player decide to end the loan early in November, the player won't be allowed to play for you again until January as Bradford will still have his registration. Where as when PL sides borrow someone from the MLS in January and they go back in March they can play straight away. It's not a transfer window here, but because the MLS window is still open at that stage the registration can be transferred back straight away. I don't think there's anything else to say about them, other than to clarify that when you sign a player on a half season or full season loan it will count as a long term loan. So due to them not being cancellable between windows, if you get a player on one of these deals you know they're not going to get recalled because the parent club has injuries, because whether there's a clause or not the player will be ineligible for the parent club until the next window (the media like to **** stir anyway). Emergency Loans Because the transfer rules were set up to suit football globally, in England we had an issue with the normal rules. Most nations when you get outside the top division or two it's basically amateur football, but we have 4, almost 5 professional divisions. That gave us the unique problem of expecting 4th and 5th tier sides to have a squad big enough to get from September to January covering all injuries and suspensions, so somehow we convinced FIFA to allow us to have emergency loans as well. The term emergency is a bit of sham as it's just a way of making out to FIFA and other nations that we're not taking the piss (even though we are). Emergency loans can only happen between 2 clubs in the English league setup (including the Welsh clubs) and cannot involve a player joining a PL side (you can borrow from us on an EL, but we can't borrow from you on one). They're between 28 and 93 days long, and the 93 days can be taken at any time during the season. As well as this meaning you can split the 93 days down into upto 3 chunks, this is per club. So a player could spend 93 days with you before Xmas and then spend 93 days with Leicester after Xmas on emergency loans. They could even spend October with you, November with Leicester, January with you again, and then go back to Leicester for almost 2 months. As they were made so that you could sign players outside the transfer windows and keep costs down by not having to commit to a half season loan when you just needed a player for a month these loans can be done at almost any time of year. Obviously the main transfer windows allow you to sign them (there's nothing to say a poor team won't need the players at that stage due to a hamstring injury or what ever but not have the cash to keep them til the next window). At the end of the main transfer window there is a one week gap where you can't sign anybody on emergency loan except in extreme circumstances (I'll detail below). After that week is up you can sign emergency loans up to, in the Autumn 5pm on the 4th Thursday in November, and in the Spring up to 5pm on the 4th Thursday in March. I have no idea how they came up with that system for calculating the deadlines, except to say that the March one seems to be the day that the old transfer deadline day used to be before the windows were introduced. Obviously clubs take the piss wih them and use them to make ordinary signings when the normal rules don't allow, like you're doing with Stewart and we did with Boyd, and like we did a few years ago when we signed a couple of players from Port Vale in November, using an emergency loan to get us through to the January when we could do the permanent deal. Equally deals like Matty Fryatt going to Sheff Wednesday earlier this season. We wouldn't have done a half season loan for him because then we wouldn't have been able to recall him and use him over Xmas (he scored for us against Fulham on 28th December), so Wednesday got a loan for a player they couldn't have had otherwise. Where the long term loans can't be recalled between windows even with a clause, emergency loans, once the first 28 days have been completed can always be terminated. All this press talk of a 24 hour recall is bollocks, in the first 28 days the player can't be recalled, after that he can be, there's never a clause, it's a standard part of the loan rules. The other thing this means is if you split the emergency loan into chunks you're better protected against a recall. Each chunk has to be 28 days before the player can be recalled. If Stewart joins you for 29 days (covering 5 Saturdays) then officially comes back to us for Sunday-Friday, when he rejoins you the next Saturday we have to wait 28 days again before we can recall him. If he does it as one loan we can recall him anytime after the first 28 days. Exceptions A long term loan can be cancelled at any time if it is to allow a player to be sold whether there is a recall clause or not (if a fee has been paid for the loan then a partial refund has to be given). So where Forest have got Jack Hobbs on a season long loan deal from us and Davies is whining away about us only being able to recall him in an emergency, it's not true. If we agree a deal to sell Hobbs to someone else the loan deal is automatically ended as soon as that transfer goes through. So if it's Wigan next week, or an MLS side at the end of February, doesn't matter, Forest lose the player. On a slight tangent, if we were to agree a summer transfer of Hobbs to Wigan, but only agree it in February then he'd stay at Forest for the rest of the season as the permanent deal couldn't be completed yet. Emergency loans can be signed after the 4th Thursday in November/March in extreme circumstances. They're the same as when a transfer embargo doesn't apply, so for outfield players I think it's when you have less than 12 fit players (suspended players count as being available, which could make it interesting at some point). Goalkeepers They're a law unto themselves. If at any time a team in any division is left with only one fit senior (professional contract) goalkeeper then they are allowed to get another one. Again, suspensions don't count, so if Kenny is red carded for violent conduct, then the next game your only other senior keeper is red carded for bringing a player down the following game they're both going to be suspended. If you haven't got another keeper then tough luck. If you find yourself in the position where you're outside the transfer window, and outside the emergency loan window (let's say it's the week before Xmas), and you've got 3 keepers but they're all injured in training. You're obviously allowed to bring a keeper in, but because you're outside the window you have to do it in a certain order. First you have to recall any keeper you can recall (so someone on an emergency loan that's over 28 days already), then any other keeper on an emergency loan, then any keeper you've loaned out on a long term loan. Only after you've done that are you allowed to sign another side's keeper on an emergency loan.
Oh and don't worry, I have that on copy and paste. One thing it wouldn't let me put in that post (too long). Long term loans count towards the 2 club rule, emergency loans don't because FIFA doesn't really recognise them happening.
