Oh. England you are a monster? The Nigels might no like that. ...then it's a dirge by greetin faced dickheads about ****e no **** cares about. Pack it in ya greetin faced wee arseholes. Martyrs ...no really, Ya fannies. **** off an get a life instead of living in one that happened back in nineteen canteen.
It's oor heritage <facepalm> 90 minute bigots. They have no clue about, or even have, Irish heritage. But, I would suspect, there are some, a few, who are aware of Irish heritage, in the Green Brigade and work their agenda on the dumbasses.
If they are going to ban songs then they should ****ing ban the orange walks. That's a national embarrassment.
I'm not going into detail on song content and whether or not the lyrics are in themselves offensive, or should be. I don't often disagree with you but if you don't think a song gloryfying some members of the PIRA is not in itself offensive then i'm wasting my time in all honesty. I find it offensive, highly offensive and i'm guessing i'm not alone. Perhaps in years to come it won't be, because old wounds do heal, maybe it will be sung openly in bars and football stadia like Flower of Scotland, but at this moment in time it as distasteful to some as it would be for the Government to give medals to the Paras for Bloody Sunday to others.
I'm quite happy to discuss the rest of your post, but lets get this nailed down first. Whether the lyrics are offensive or not is exactly what you have been critiquing.This is what you said: You don't want to discuss the content but you are happy to label it as offensive. If you really are standing by your statement, then now is the time to do it. Don't shy away from it. You see this is the point right here. I'll quote you again. Leave it to the law? The law makers are trying to declare something offensive not because it is inherently offensive (because it just isn't) but because of events the song might obliquely reference. That is insanity. And here's the kicker Dev. Bear in mind what I just quoted. So which is it?
It's a song about members of the PIRA. It's simple really, you don't find that offensive, many do and whether you will admit it or not that is a fact.
Controversy about the Green Brigade goes on and on, seemingly without a hint of a line in the sand. It transpires that seven members of Celtic’s ‘Ultras’ now face trial for allegedly singing a song – Roll of Honour – in support of IRA hunger strikers. On the back of the Bobby Sands banner against AC Milan and loutish behaviour away to Motherwell this is the last thing the club needs. The treatment and future of the Green Brigade is something which is already dividing many Hoops fans. The group have rightly been praised for bringing much needed noise and colour to Parkhead, but find themselves out in the cold because the political wind is no longer blowing in their direction. The plain truth of the matter is that it’s just not going to change anytime soon. Rightly or wrongly both Uefa – who were happy enough to stage their own tribute to the late Nelson Mandela – and the Scottish Government have now changed their rules to outlaw anything which is deemed political at football grounds. All of this leaves Celtic in rather a tricky spot. The club has an association with the cause of Irish Nationalism (or Home Rule) which goes back to its earliest days through figures such as John Glass and Michael Davitt.However that does not mean all fans – nor the majority of Scots – wish to be reminded of the horrors which have beset Northern Ireland in recent decades.This is what the Green Brigade failed to spot. Now they are all but gone from the ground, and I would argue Celtic are worse off for that. Those who make up this group were never going to bend. They see themselves as the authentic voice of the old Jungle, people who have refused to sell-out in the face of commercialism in football. Why should political expression be a crime they ask? It’s a good question, but pointless as things stand in the eyes of the law. How about this for a radical thought: the Celtic directors should call a meeting of shareholders – akin to an EGM – plus representatives of the Green Brigade, senior politicians and police. Such a gathering would allow a fair hearing for all sides. It may also provide important advice and carve a path out of these recent difficulties. http://metro.co.uk/2013/12/19/why-p...gnore-the-issue-of-the-green-brigade-4235985/
I understand you are offended Dev and i don't dispute that you are. My contention is clear and that is that the quote below is wholly inaccurate. It is a strange way to stand by a statement to just refuse to discuss it.
I think it's been discussed in great detail on this and other threads, no one is interested any more as it seems only you and I are going over the same ground again. What purpose can be served in discussing it any further when we are both convinced of our own view on the song? It's politics and I doubt either of us will be changing our minds any time soon.
It absolutely has not been discussed in depth on this or any other thread. The purpose of talking about it is that you are trying to shift the focus of the discussion away from your misplaced assertion and onto your feelings in the subject matter rather than the actual content. Specifically, you have made an assertion about the content of the song. An assertion that is wholly false. An assertion that you have said you stand by but are now distancing yourself from through your words and deeds. Whether it is just you and I, or every one on the forum getting involved. You have made this assertion that others will make in the application of this farcical legislation. I am asking you to stand it up, and you can't. This leaves us with a song being sang with zero intention to offend and zero offensive content being censured under anti offensive behaviour legislation. This is absurd in the extreme. It isn't the content that offends anyone Dev. That is the point you have been asked to address.
A song in praise of PIRA members is inherently offensive to many, irrespective of the precise lyrics. That may seem illogical to you but it's also factual. It's the mere act of praising these people that is seen as offensive.
The content is the Provisional IRA, singing songs about Proscribed organisations is against the law, it has been for some time, it was before the new legislation and whether you think the new legislation is wrong or not is neither here nor there because the content (or the subject) of the song remains against the law the same as it would be for anyone else singing about any other Proscribed organisations as it has been for years. I'm can tell you through my lifetime's experience of living and working in Glasgow, and supporting Celtic and probably knowing a lot more Celtic and Rangers fans than you (perhaps?) that the vast majority of the population of Scotland (which is where the song was sung, and the people arrested for singing it) find it offensive. They find any chanting, singing or glorifying of any Irish Paramilitary group offensive, it is poison to them. That is why such songs are confined to clubs and the like which are supportive of the political messages contained within the songs. A tiny proportion of Scottish society is interested enough in the politics of NI to join these clubs, that is also borne out by the balance of opinion on this Forum, how many Scots Celtic fans on this forum have expressed support for Irish Republican politics? Not many. Not many in Scotland want to hear this song or any other songs that have nout to do with the team they support. Can I prove it? Of course not, do I know it? Yes, for certain, that's why I stand by my assertion.
I suppose no one is beelin enough. You'll notice there's no playing the man on this board, we play the ball and leave out the insults.
Don't forget the guys who weren't PIRA members. Apart from that i think you have made my point for me fairly well. What other things do folk find inherently offensive? Homosexuality? Catholicism? Shall we criminalise the Village people and Sunday Mass?
