Allen has a very good technical foundation - short passing, control and movement are his strengths. Similar to Lucas and Henderson when they were struggling initially - I had faith because you see they have a foundation on which to build on. If he can work on his game intelligence and he can be a good player. But this side of the game comes after years of experience. I'm not saying he's a world beater but I'm not as quick as you to write him off. The players I mentioned above are good squad players and we really should be looking at better quality if we want to push on.
Don't know about Sakho but when Kelly came back and played in the reserves he looked awful, I mean shocking. I'm not being harsh because at first I just thought "he needs game time" but I was genuinely concerned at how slow he was. It actually looked like he still had an injury. He hasn't played for them last couple of reserve games has he Magic which if it was only fitness and we obviously need 1st team cover you'd expect him to be given priority to get him up to speed.
Defensively - I've never been a fan of Johnson. I know a few lads on here would disagree but he's slow when it comes to closing down, his positioning isn't great and he is prone to lapses in concentration. Offensively - very dangerous on his day. Unfortunately, he's far too inconsistent and he has been suffering for about a year now (may be less). And we're talking about the basics - passing, decision making. He dwells on the ball, loses the initiative and ends up passing back or getting surrounded. On top of the fact he has no competition and he's on mega wages, I think we'll be looking at selling him in the summer.
This is a problem neither player is quite good enough to be starting week after week especially away games. Was supposed to quote Dave in this aswell regarding Allen.
Ive been getting mad at why he cant get fit to start a ****ing game but that explains it then Frank if hes still carrying a niggle/injury
Sakho picked up a knock not too long ago and still working to full fitness. Kelly is still working back to full fitness. Hope he pulls through but I think he could be on his way soon as well.
I'm quick to write him off becuase he's the complete all rounder - can't run, can't tackle, can't see a forward pass, can't shoot BUT can pass sideways, can pass backwards, can slow any impetus down. He's not got what it takes to be a squad player in a world class midfield - and that is where we must be aiming.
Not lost hope in the lad yet... He needs a run of games before we can pass judgement, hoping he does an Ramsey and turns into a special player soon #doubtitbuticandreamcanti
I agree, I still think he can make the grade. I also want us to buy a midfielder in Jan though so I'm obviously not that confident.
£15 million is just too much money to risk on a player who just might develop into a reasonable squad player. I rest my case.
Is right. You don't spend £15m on 'potential' when the player in question is already 21 & has 150 first team games under his belt. For that kind of dosh at that sort of age, you should be sure you're buying quality. Joe Allen simply isn't a £15m player, never has been, never will be.
Problem is Dave, the money isn't risked its spent. So like Downing before him, until we get an improved replacement we may as well use him and hope to get some above average performance from him. If you're right we'll still lose a whack load of money. If J is right we'll either have a useful squad player or less of a loss when sold on. I wouldn't normally say play a player for the sake of it but as I also said , looking at the standard of our midfield overall, I don't see the difference in currently playing in him or Lucas; they're both overwhelmed due to the midfield imbalance. Or him and Henderson, neither are positionally aware, neither make big disruptive tackles, neither make defense splitting passes and neither score a whack load of goals ... We need two new midfielders.
The whole midfield needs overhauling. We need at least 2 new midfielders if we want to be competing at the highest level. A DM and B2B.
frank, I totally agree with you that we need a new midfield. From our present players I would retain the following: Lucas, Gerrard, Henderson, Coutinho and Alberto. I have not included wingers in the midfield crew as they are not midfielders they are forwards. I have included Gerrard even though I feel that this will be his last full season as I can see him performing a Giggs type role (both on the pitch and the training ground) from next season on. That leaves us with 1 established DM and 1 precocious AM. Neither Henderson or Alberto can be classified as established. Alberto is an untried and Henderson only shows signs of being a good workhorse. Now if we have 1 workhorse why do we need to retain a less powerful one in Allen? We do need replacements who offer specific skills that can be brought in and off the bench to meet specific needs.
So would you just sell him now, no matter the loss? That's not a loaded question as I've never been sure whether we just except a manager gets it wrong from time to time (as long as it's not too often) and unfortunately the higher up the league you go the likelihood is those mistakes will cost a fair whack. (Obviously then, the less mistakes can be made). Chances are we'd be lucky to get 8M for him at the moment. So do we take it now or wait until we get the replacements in & use him in the meantime?
He could be used in January to make money for some one else, i.e. get £7-8m for him and buy a £20m man who will hopefully improve our midfield hugely. I also think that we can't focus all our attention on getting Allen out then everything is rosy again, players that we love such as Lucas do need looking at as he is simply not at the grade he was prior to his long lay offs.
If we could afford to buy a player without having to sell him, then there's no point IMO. I doubt there he's on big wages either. However, if the proceeds from the sale are key to securing another signing or 2, then I would do it. Sounds ruthless but I would.
Funny thing is that Allen has hardly played this season yet he's still a scape goat. Try looking at the players who have played this season and who are constantly getting dominated, and under performing.
