Your anti-England comments have been disappointing matth. You have to be prepared to take abuse if you annoy people (which you never learn).
where have i been '' anti-England'' in this thread ? also i'm happy because we got a point away at Belgium.
Agreed. Decent PL defenders but nowhere near top international standard. Would not come close to making any of the top 20 international teams' first XI's... I'm not sure what the solution is for the World Cup next year. Bring back the golden oldies, play the 'safe' but average current central defenders, or take a chance with youth?
World Top 20 Spain Argentina Germany Italy Colombia Belgium Uruguay Brazil Netherlands Croatia Portugal Greece USA Switzerland Russia Chile England Bosnia-Herzegovina Côte d'Ivoire Ecuador Not a massive Cahill fan, but he'd easily get in most of those sides.
I think with Cahill and Jagelka and Jones and Smalling we've a good mix of (relative) experience and youth and promise. No way on this earth should we even consider giving Terry or Ferdinand a call. Have I missed anyone? I genuinely can't think at present of other English centre halves other than perhaps Lescott. We aren't going to win the world cup, not a chnance, so may as well use it as good preparation for the euro's when we've a far better chance of competing at least with the likes of Wilshere and Barkley in the centre and Welbeck, Ravel Morrisson, Andros Townsend and Zaha (who will by then be the best in the world of course) etc. being that bit older. We should have a half decent team for Euro 2016. The only concern about this world cup, and I'm not concerned at all really, is instead of giving some younger players experience he'll play 'safe' and go back to some old heads who will inevitably stink the whole tournament out.
I think with Cahill and Jagelka and Jones and Smalling we've a good mix of (relative) experience and youth and promise. No way on this earth should we even consider giving Terry or Ferdinand a call. Have I missed anyone? I genuinely can't think at present of other English centre halves other than perhaps Lescott. We aren't going to win the world cup, not a chance, so may as well use it as good preparation for the euro's when we've a far better chance of competing at least with the likes of Wilshere and Barkley in the centre and Welbeck, Ravel Morrisson, Andros Townsend and Zaha (who will by then be the best in the world of course) etc. being that bit older. We should have a half decent team for Euro 2016. The only concern about this world cup, and I'm not concerned at all really, is instead of giving some younger players experience he'll play 'safe' and go back to some old heads who will inevitably stink the whole tournament out.
I doubt he'd get anywhere near the starting eleven for the big nations on that list, but even teams like Greece and Croatia have pretty solid defensive options.
How many of them have played in a C.L final etc? Saying 'solid options' is one thing, saying Cahill would get 'nowhere near' is another. The reality is that there aren't the level of amazing centre backs there was 5-10 years ago. Luiz gets slaughtered but is pretty much nailed on to start for Brazil, Mertasacker is average, Spains centre halves are good players, not great defenders (especially post Puyol) etc. Bet you couldn't even name the first choice partnership for half them nations.
Mertesacker isn't a great defender but his strong points are Cahill's too so it's an even battle (both are slow on the turn but good in the air), Pique and Ramos are still miles ahead of the likes of Cahill (and Jagielka), and Luiz isn't as nailed on as you think with the likes of Thiago Silva, Dante. Dede and Miranda on the scene, Germany have Hummels, Boateng (average defender I know but he has also played in a champions league final which was something you made a big deal out of), Howedes and Badstuber, Italy have Barzagli, Bonucci, Chiellini and Ogbonna, even smaller teams like Croatia (Lovren and Vida) and Greece (Papastathopoulos and Papadopoulos) have good options, then there's teams like Russia who have excellent defensive partnerships in their squad who all play together at club level, players who may not be quite as good but have an excellent understanding together, Cahill would struggle to get in to all of those starting elevens if you ask me.
Fair enough. Cahill would be 3rd if not 4th choice for me at Chelsea so it's not like I'm his biggest fan but just though the original comment was a bit overboard. For as much as you could make a case for him not getting in a team, you could easily make a case for him getting in most of them too. Germany for instance only have Hummels who I'd say is clearly better and they are probably the 2nd best team in Europe. Pique and Ramos are good but often have little to do at club and international level and as I said, good footballers not great defenders. Ramos is a better full back IMO as he makes a lot of mistakes. But Cahill and Jag are nowhere near Terry and Rio of 5 years ago who were genuinely 2 of the best in the world.
I agree Ramos isn't an amazing center back, but he's still better than the current England defenders, and for the record Germany have plenty of very good defenders, Hummels is just their big name at the back, the likes of Howedes and Badstuber are also excellent, and there are plenty of other players available to them that nobody seems to know unless you watch a lot of the Bundesliga because they aren't household names, players like Westermann and Niedermeier. It's not that Cahill is ****, he's a decent player to have in a squad plus he's strong in the air, but the fact that he's a starter for England doesn't say too much about our options at the back at the minute and that was always one of England's main strengths, just look at his main competition at the minute, Caulker, Lescott and possibly Jones (only if he was to get a regular start in that position at club level though), Smalling is also making the squad but he's never going to be first choice for his club never mind his country, he's just another useful squad player, none of those are going to scare the top strikers at the world cup.
True. I think you could say that throughout the team though. The squad shows some promise but I'm struggling to name many world class players in that side. Yeah we looked good last week when playing average sides at home. But in Brazil against the very best we won't even have the ball for 60-65% of the time. We'll look even more blunt if Rooney carries on his recent tournament form. Realistically, quarter final at best???
