I saw a similar picture on FBI. It showed a picture (Photoshop) of a dog wearing a full face veil and head cover, with just it's ears, ears and nose showing. Caption was this was a guide dog for blind Muslims - the garment is called A Barker! Now I did rather laugh at that!
Dan, there are quite a few cultural practices in the Middle East that pre-date Islam but which we, in the west, attribute to Islam. The practices that subjugate women are more about maintaining traditional power structures. It should not be forgotten that women in the West have only recently begun to achieve anything resembling equality as the West has become more secular. The subjugation of women was justified by careful selection of quotations from the Bible, just as racism has also been justified. Liberal Islam can be very empowering but the fundamentalists are the ones in power at the moment. It will change, just as social norms in Christian countries changed. I find it fascinating that fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims have very similar social views, particularly when science is being discussed.
What about the Allan Smart 'even though he's from Scotland' chant ? Could that be regarded as racist ? I will admit to singing it myself back in the day - and I have Scottish roots.
Best chant ever, repeated over and over again was EJTMA. I remember being at the Vic when it started up and went round the whole ground drowning out the comments about the chairman. Memory might be going, but I still think it went on for half an hour non-stop.
Yes OFH, it used to go on and on. At away games, we used to sing it the whole second half. Another funny one came to mind this morning- when we were in The Prem we were at home to Everton and we were walking along Vic Road to the game alongside a bunch of Everton fans who starting singing...(to the ever popular Sloop John B) The babies not yours The babies not yours Oh Steven Gerrard The babies not yours We were rolling up...
Remember that at West Brom where I think we were being done over 3-1. And I got done over on the way back to my car. Never really liked WBA since.
Interrupted for breakfast whilst reading this thread... on the telly was Sunday Morning Live on BBC1 which had a discussion about Muslim women and the veil followed by a discussion on Spurs and the "Yid Army" chants. Spooky! Anyway if a woman wants to, or feels obliged to, wear a veil that is her choice. She cannot expect to command much in the way of respect and must expect to be treated with suspicion (not that I am saying that that is right, but she must expect it). If she wishes to believe in bronze age fairy tales and kow-tow to a morality that allows her to be beaten if, for whatever reason, she does not wish to do what her husband tells her to do then she cannot expect any respect. A non-Muslim is an infidel and not worthy and those who do not believe are fair game for whatever disrespect they get. It does not get much better when dealing with any fundamentalist version of any religion, and any non-fundamentalist version of that religion is just a diluted version for the modern day. It is all nonsense - it is impossible to prove or disprove the existence of 'god' - that is what faith is: the belief in something that cannot, empirically, be proven. What annoys me most is that these people then purport to hold the moral high ground and say that without god, and there is only one true god and only one truth, there can be not morality - which is patently absurd. One can no more prove the truth of the Bible than the Qur'an, the Talmud or any other scripture - let alone which version is the "right" one... there are over 30,000 denominations of Christian Church alone all saying that their way is the true way. Rant over, back on thread: I remember when Pat van den Hauwe was playing for Millwall and he got a rather prolonged chant that his wife (former young bride of a Rolling Stone old man, "xxxxx xxxxx is a slapper" from the Watford fans. I remember that same night at the New Den a Millwall fan wearing a pink suit who got all manner of homophobic chants aimed at him: "you're pink and you know you are"; "does your boyfriend know you're here?" and my favourite of the night "In touch with your feminine side". The hissing directed at Spurs fans is by far the worst but I do not recall us doing it, thank goodness! If Spurs fans want to sing Yid Army then, as a club with a significant Jewish following, then I think they are perfectly entitled to. Not a word I'd use but then I could not possibly use it in the context it is intended. People need to get a grip on what is or is not genuinely offensive rather than jump on the band wagon of what a minority deem to be offensive. Don't forget we had "Marlon says you're a C**T" after his sending off at Wolves - funny, but still offensive. Not our finest hour really.
Good post Fez! This is a situation that can never be satisfactorily solved for all sides because there are some huge anomalies! For instance, my name is David, I am perfectly happy to be called Dave, no offence there, yet to call someone from Pakistan by a shortened version, or a Yiddish person also using the shortened form, whilst not necessarily meant in an abusive manner, is always taken as such! I can't see any other option than to not use language that can be taken offensively, whether intended or not!
getting offended on behalf of others is particularly curtain twitching- the spurs fans have demonstrated that they 'own' the right to use the Y word--get a grip !
Another rather funny chant from our fans from a couple of years ago when we has Rasiak playing for us. To the tune of "My old mans a dustman.." Rasiak is Polish He wears a builders hat And when we saw the East Stand He said, I'm having some of that
