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Southampton need Gastón Ramírez to pull them together in midfield

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by - Doing The Lambert Walk, Sep 15, 2013.

  1. rabbitspectrum

    rabbitspectrum Member

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    Gaston needs quick front foot ball with players in space to be effective, we have rarely had this in games but the good thing about gaston is that he generates good quick ball and space for others. Give him a run of 90 minutegames and there will be more space and the team will play more direct and more threatening football.

    Against colombia a couple of days ago he was as good as anyone on the pitch and looked absolute quality. This suggests that he isn't in bad form, although he hasn't always impressed in the short spells for us this season, which is not really a good way of judging his worth to the team especially when he has actually looked very good at times or at least has won free kicks and played good forward passes.
     
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  2. Schad

    Schad Well-Known Member

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    Indeed. But right now, we're playing with -- to borrow a phrase -- our XI best, not our best XI. Whether Gaston is better than our other options is somewhat immaterial, if he adds something that we are currently lacking. I believe that he does; for his flaws, he puts pressure on defenders, and he should provide a central outlet that we're currently lacking. And he is a player who likes to play at a frenetic tempo...too much so at times, but on recent results that might be preferable to the slow-as-molasses buildup we have experienced.
     
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  3. Saintjoey

    Saintjoey Well-Known Member

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    How can people call for Maya to start when we look more solid defensively now than we have done since the days of Killer and Claus and the 8 clean sheets in a row days?!
     
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  4. I Sorry I Ruined The Party

    I Sorry I Ruined The Party Well-Known Member

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    The article is pointing out that there is no link-up between the attackers and the midfield. Are you really arguing that Rodriguez is a better attacking midfielder than Ramirez?

    Rodriguez doesn't drop back, he does the opposite and tries to get behind the defenders. He's more the guy who receives the pass than creates it. And he has 0 goals this year, so it's not like he's even catering to his strengths.

    Rodriguez and Lallana have 0 goals and 0 assists between them this year, what have they done to keep their place? Admittedly, Ramirez hasn't exactly gotten the job done either. But the truth is that Ramirez has probably been better than Lallana since he joined the team, it's just that people refuse to see it. Both have been inconsistent but people only look at when Lallana does well and conversely focus on what Ramirez does wrong.
     
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  5. Dark Lord SFC

    Dark Lord SFC Well-Known Member

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    Gaston is great for using up column inches on this forum and no doubt this one will run and run.
    If he was doing the business in training then I am sure MP will pick him and we must trust MP to make the right decision and he sees the players on a day to day basis.
    I would suggest the away game at Anfield is not the place to try him as we will need to flood midfield but home to Palace? Why not as we all want him to succeed.
     
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  6. Dell Boy

    Dell Boy Well-Known Member

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    Very hard to disagree with any of this, I think Gaston needs to up his game before the January window opens or his time with us could be very short.
     
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  7. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    That's not right though, is it? If Osvaldo had placed his shot instead of blasting it at the keeper in the first half, if Rickie's header in the second half had gone in off the post, if Lallana's first touch, which is usually one of the best in the game, hadn't just let him down when Osvaldo played him in, we wouldn't be having this conversation. There were plenty of signs yesterday that the team was starting to gel nicely, despite the frustrating result.
     
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  8. Mr_Saintly

    Mr_Saintly Well-Known Member

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    I think the reason Gaston didn't play today is because there was just no space in midfield for him to work. Nolan and Noble would have bullied him off the ball at every possible chance and we would have got nowhere. Next game though I'd like to see him come in for Jay.
     
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  9. Beddy

    Beddy Plays the percentage

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    Someone said that a certain player needs to up their game, suggesting a replacement could be bought in the January window.......Interesting point.......however the question I am asking myself is how much of our current style is down to the managers instructions on how they want an individual to play and what the manager instructs him to do. Are we suffering a little bit of "lack of British football methods knowledge" If teams are closing you down fast you need to move the ball quicker not slower. We were so nearly caught in possession at the back because of our insistence to not vary our game. We were so predictable at times it was embarrassing. We could have easily lost that game just because of our naivety. Again it is just my opinion after watching on the TV as I could not get to the game.
     
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  10. pass the football

    pass the football Well-Known Member

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    Not calling for him to start necessarily, but he wasn't even on the bench. Also he showed last season that he's better than Fonte. Maybe Fonte has improved, I can accept that's a possibility, but only more games will show that.

    That would have been papering over the cracks, which lets face it have been showing for some time now. Maybe it's best that we didn't get a goal because now the coaching staff will feel under pressure to do something about it.

    West Ham's midfielders were closing down Schneiderlin and Wanyama effectively, but there would have been space behind them. I think Ramirez would have used that space well. But there's no convincing people who are anti-Ramirez that he can be useful in any situation it seems (not referring to you).
     
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  11. fatletiss

    fatletiss Well-Known Member

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    We did nearly get caught in possession a few times Beddy. See my reply to you on the other thread. It responds to moving the ball quickly, but is aimed at teams that sit back, in open play, not from a goal kick which is what I think you are referring to as West Ham pushed a man on to the CB/FB when they looked to get the ball. That makes it tough, because the next option is to play it long. We need to make sure that we get a man close enough in space to receive the ball in those situations. There was one occasion when Shaw had the ball and he had an option to play the ball to feet down the line, but chose to go back to Boruc; this is where MP needs to be telling them to go forward to feet. If they push men on then, there must be a man free I the middle.
     
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  12. Lovelocum

    Lovelocum Well-Known Member

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    ?
     
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  13. pass the football

    pass the football Well-Known Member

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    Last season.
     
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  14. Lff

    Lff Well-Known Member

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    I have never rated Ramirez. However, there must be something to his game that he hasn't showed us yet, either that or our scouts are very poor!

    As such, and I can't believe I'm saying this, maybe he should get a start. I'm not saying he deserves a start but something is definitely lacking in that midfield (Puncheon and Cork actually but we'll see!).
     
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  15. pass the football

    pass the football Well-Known Member

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    It just puzzles me that we have a £12m playmaker on the bench, and when we need to crack open a defence Pochettino turns to Steven Davis (no disrespect to him, but really).

    It was only Shaw's enforced removal that stopped Davis from coming on. And we finished the game having only made two substitutions.
     
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  16. Qwerty

    Qwerty Well-Known Member

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    Just read through that tactical thing that we did after Norwich. I only half watched that one but a few themes... tempo, subs, and the Lambert question.



    I had hoped that having Clyne and Shaw starting would be what we needed to pull around stubborn Hammers and bring us some generally awesome overlapping wingplay. It didn't really happen enough in their half apart from a couple of occasions like the Osvaldo chance. Although they defended well yet again, hopefully a few more games will lead to some more development. We were barely troubled from corners/free kicks, I noticed, apart from once where Maiga somehow chested it in the box (away from himself).

    Would also like to see Gaston get half an hour behind Osvaldo. I love Lambert as much as all of you, a change of approach might help us to make some breakthroughs. We did sign these extra first team players to give us options on the bench, clearly there is a balance between that and chopping everyone at half time without giving them half a chance. With all these bloody international breaks there is a lack of training problem that hopefully we can crack in the next two weeks, just before everyone goes off again :steam:

    If Osvaldo had barely been involved we would have all been saying "it's early, give him time" etc, but he has actually made a really good impression on me. He missed our best chance but created our second best with some great vision (Lallana), if Adam found the right touch we would have creamed and quite rightly too. So, optimism to be had there too.
     
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  17. Lovelocum

    Lovelocum Well-Known Member

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    Ah yes I see. Can't remember if he played this season against sunderland- did he come on for Lallana?
     
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  18. fatletiss

    fatletiss Well-Known Member

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    That's an odd logic PTF. I'm not sure scoring 2 or 3 goals would have been papering over the cracks. If one of those had gone in, we'd have won the game; job done. I still don't get this "been showing for some time." We haven't scored many at the end of last season. We've brought three more in and they have been here for 4 games. It is clear that the team has not quite found it's feet and the new players are settling in, but we have had two ok home performances against teams that do all they can to stop you playing and had enough chances to win them both. I don't understand the negativity. If we weren't creating chances and were getting battered by teams and hanging on for a point, the fair enough. I am not saying we were great, but we were far from really bad (albeit poor first half).

    What are your expectations? Do you think we are or should be a top 4, top 6 or top 8 team? If not, then any game in this league will be a tough, hard fought fixture where you have to craft out a victory. I've seen enough to believe that will happen enough times to be slightly improved on our position form last year.
     
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  19. fatletiss

    fatletiss Well-Known Member

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    What?!!!????!!??? No!! I can't believe that :laugh:<whistle>
     
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  20. fatletiss

    fatletiss Well-Known Member

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    I do agree with you PTF, but for the sake of trying to see the flip side, maybe he believes that Davis can find that little simple ball like the pass for JayRod against Chelsea. Not my opinion, but just trying to look at things from all angles.
     
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