Michael Collins

again though, that's because you don't understand the facts. it was such a high figure because provos called for a boycott of the election. still out of those who voted, a significant minority of catholics voted to remain in the uk. it's the provos who try to avoid elections, not the british. the provos tried to stop the north having a vote regarding the free state, but they were given a vote which is why they were kept out of it. the provos held a vote in 1937 to leave the british empire, which excluded northern Ireland, and only 38% of the electorate of southern Ireland voted in favour. when the north had a referendum in 1973 the provos tried to enforce a boycott.

 

again, it's just a hollow, pointless comment. you don't understand the issues, and don't want to know the truth, so you come up with this hopeless bull****. it's pathetic.

 

So they sampled in Dublin huh? the centre of British Administration at the time. Nope, the high population influx from England wont affect the geneaology in that city one bit. Why dont they sample Cork, Clare, Galway, Donegal etc. and see what they come up with

 

what are you trying to say here ? If you explain why you think your comment is significant, then I will address it.

 

at the time ? the study was done about 5 years ago ? Dublin was not the centre of british administration in 2008.

well they'll come up with something slightly different in those parts because both countries have been invaded by separate people since their original shared roots. what are you suggesting ? that actually only the west of Ireland should be independent because they only share old blood with the english, not new blood ? again, your point seems not to have any logic to it.

 

it's not that which is making you irritated. I know that you don't know what you are talking about because you evade talking about it, and when you do you get it wrong; it doesn't irritate me though. im not irritate, because I know I am right and I know you don't know what you are talking about. The reason you are irittated is because you don't know that you are right, because you know that you don't actually know anything about it.

 

More condescending ill informed tripe. So there was boycott, therefore the figures are an inaccurate reflection of the true population. Also the small minority of catholics who wanted to remain in the UK would have likely voted as they wouldnt have agreed with any boycott. The % of catholic voted to remain in the UK is therefore a grossly inaccurate reflection of the catholic populace at large.

The "Provos" (they didnt exist in 1937 you ***** and he has the nerve to condescend to other people on their knowledge of the subject) did not include NI as they had exercised their ability to secede from the Free State by this stage, how are you not getting this.

 

Not a single person has brought up the geneaology aspect but you, so I am asserting nothing. I am stating there will be a lasting impact on the geneaology of specific areas, such as Dublin, as a result of the high level to which the area was populated by people from England during the time of British administration. Therefore no accurate assumptions can be made from this study due to a poor sampling methodology

 

I had to tell you this about 20 minutes ago, when you asked why they weren't allowed to join the republic. you are now trying to make out that I don't know something that I taught you 20 minutes ago.

something I haven't taught you yet is that the 1937 constitution purported to encompass the people of northern Ireland. consistently throughout northern Ireland's history, they have voted overwhelmingly in favour of union, so it's inevitable that the 38% of the free state's electorate who voted to leave the british empire in 1937 would have been an even lower figure, if the people who the constitution purported to govern were allowed a say on it.

 

bull****. several posters - almost everyone who has been in the discussion tonight - accused me of being racist for making a joke about irish people. that suggests that the posters considered Ireland to be a race apart. this was confirmed when I commented and in reply was asked to substantiate my claim that Irish was not a race. I responded to that post by posting a gene map which shows that irish are the same race as English.

Out of interest, what is it that you think justifies the argument for an independent country being invented in the 20th century, if it is not on grounds of race ?

 

Hilarious, you taught me that I dismiss, but I do remember teaching you the vote was 1937, not 1927 as you oft claimed

The constitution passed with a vote of 56.5%, where are you getting the 38% from. Be careful now as this can quickly link back to the while "98.9% vote" you have mentioned previously if you are going down the route I think you are

 

my dear boy please, dont confuse Israel and Ireland.

You really need to check on your definitions of what defines ethnicity and as a result a Nationality from which a nation is derived. I have already shown your gene map to be inaccurate at best but here is a few definitions from peer reviewed articles

 

Hold my hand up here unfortunately I'm from 'The Pale' so we were the first to lose our culture,language etc and it gradually spread but not much so by your reckoning 'The Plantation of Ulster' and to 'Hell or to Connaught' was to rid Geordies,Scousers and Cockneys and it was the faux Irish that moved in afterwards.

 

it doesn't look bad at all.

both votes were on whether to change the status quo.

the vote in the north was whether to legally and democratically leave the united kingdom. the republicans didn't want the truth to be known so they tried to impose a boycott. in spite of the boycott, and in spite of the intimidation and threats to blow up polling stations, nearly 60% of the entire electorate voted in favour of remaining in the uk - some 98% of votes cast.

in contrast, the vote in the south was not recognised by the constitution. it was technically an undemocratic vote, as recognised by William Cosgrave in 1931. notwithstanding that, it was a vote on whether to take the monumental step of leaving the british empire. this step that legend today tells us the whole of ireland was desperate to achieve. compared to the 98% of votes cast in th north who voted in favour of staying in the uk though, 56% of votes in the south were in favour of leaving, which equated to 38% of the electorate. 38% in a free election, compared to the 60% the other way in the north inspite of the republicans attempt to boycott and disrupt the northern election. there's no comparison atall. it's a pathetic turn out, and a pathetic result. where were the hoardes of irishers desperate to get away from the evil british ? they were stuck at home without a care in the world. 38% of people who could have voted to leave the british empire did so. I in 3 of catholic southern Ireland. how is that a mandate for independence ? it's not; it's a sham. just as sinn fein tried to illegally declare independence without a mandate in 1918, they did it again after 1937. they couldn't even get the pope to endorse it.

 

you've shown my gene map to be inaccurate ? it's a fackin scientific study ? how the fak can you show it to be inaccurate ?

"what defines ethnicity and as a result nationality" ? what's that supposed to mean ?

I don't need to check, that's the point. I know that Ireland has no right to be an independent country, and that there is no reason why Ireland should be an independent country.

you seem to think differently. i'm asking you on what basis. you must have some reasons ?

I can't check what your reasons are can I ? that's why im asking you

come on, explain yourself. what is the justification for ireland to be an independent country ?