Funnily enough. when I first spent Xmas with my current Missus and her family in South Wales (about 15 year ago) I went down to the old Vetch for a game against Barnet during the Xmas break - the club was on its knees - no way could I ever envisage the respective positions of our two clubs now and that they would be in the position to bring in the leading goalscorer in Dutch football having won a major trophy - it would have been more realistic to think they were in danger of dropping into the conference.
One thing is for certain..the policy has to change.. one year rolling contracts for managers... on a lot less money...with a bonus for success, take it or leave it.. the club are in the driving seat in negotiations , or should be, there is never a shortage of applicants. I bet nigel couldn't believe his fookin luck..our owners were mugs... a lot of so called "talented" people have turned this club into a mediocre entity..
Its the lack of stability that has got the club in the mess. We need to stick with a manager for some time to achieve success Nigel has had a year to build a team and now its about getting results. Going Gung ho every season is getting us nowhere and costing us big time In the long run if we have to accept 1 year of building to achieve success then somewhat. We finished in the play offs last season people need to remember that. Last time we was in this position we self destructed by losing Nigel. Surely people can only see getting rid of Nigel would see history repeat itself but this time only worse
So you dont regard finshing in the play offs first season back from League 1 as succesful Last season we reached the play offs since the first time since a certain manager left. Sven spent no end on loans and then transfer fees and we failed both years Play offs was the minimum requirement last year and we did it. Play offs again will be the minimum requirement this year but promotion is a must
Its a theory.. but there are just as many examples of new managers coming in to new clubs and getting up straight away..
We shouldn't have been in League one in the first place. Achieving the 'minimum requirement' is an unsuccessful season if you're ambitious. We shouldn't look back on a season where we might as well have finished 21st as successful. Promotion is success. We should have done it ages ago.
I think people in all walks of life should be on performance related pay, so I agree with you entirely. Though I'd apply it to players ahead of managers.
Well in danger of stating the obvious - he is the manager You say above that achieving the play-offs last season was the 'minimum requirement' - I'd agree - but I don't rate that as 'success' - success would have been promotion - and the FACT that we only managed the play-offs by the skin of our teeth - an injury time winner with other results going for us - and that Nigel appeared unable to manage us out of an incredibly poor run from an automatic promotion position has left me, personally, unconvinced by him as a manager who can take the club where I want it to go. You appear to think that I don't 'like' Nigel rather than just not 'rating' him as a manager - as I've said numerous times, I neither like or dislike the man - I'm only interested in the fortunes of my football club. Billy Davies has 'achieved' the play offs numerous times but you don't get that Forest WUM coming on here listing those in his club's achievements do you? You are right that you need stability at a club - but only if the manager is actually any good - otherwise you've merely stabilised mediocrity (or worse). I'll be behind Nigel Pearson and the team 100% this coming season - but for me - and I'm not alone in this -he has an awful lot of convincing to do to prove that he is the right man for the job... and that is all.
Fosse, every time you are just proving my point for me, by listing top flight teams who have taken cups seriously and performed well in them. That's what I want for us. But we aren't a top flight team (yet ). I have already made my point that the three promoted teams last season realised the cups weren't important to them. Want me to go back further? Previous Championship winners Reading went out in the first round of the League Cup to Charlton, and the third round (first round they played) of the FA cup to Stevenage. What effect did it have on them? They had an amazing end-of-season and stormed their way to the title. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm not saying it's right. But you are saying we should be competing on all fronts, and play our strongest team week in/week out. I am showing you that the promoted teams in recent seasons have done quite the opposite, and taken the cup games as a chance to rest players.
Look at Wigan. They took the FA cup seriously and they took their eye off the league While they won the FA cup they got relegated. Im sure the fans are happy with that but I dont think the club will be. Losing out on all that money just for a couple of million won through winning the FA cup and getting into europe Cups now longer are attractive as they were, if we finished mid table and won a cup you would be calling for Nigel's head then. While we are in this league cup competitions are insignificant in the grand scheme on things
Jack I do get your point and it is very well made - but mine is that those clubs might still have achieved what they did whilst at the same time having a serious go at the cups. I cite the examples I've given to show that it is possible to compete for everything and do very well - irrespective of what League you are in etc- I personally feel that 'resting players' is a 'flawed' concept - unless they are actually carrying a knock.
Wigan got relegated because they were one of three teams that did not get enough points - and that is all. They might have achieved exactly the same points total without the cup run and therefore still have gone down - none of us will ever know. The season before they had an 'incredible'escape and to repeat that again was a huge ask statistically. Now let's just for a moment imagine that they had not had a cup run and had gone down - let's face it, they have been amongst the favourites for relegation every season that they have been in the Prem - where would they be now - their best players leaving and not exactly the most exciting prospect for would be recruits. By contrast - the prospect that they are in Europe next season has actually seen them able to recruit players of the calibre of Foster, Perch and Holt 9amonst others) and put them right at the top of the betting for a quick return to the Prem - if they were to go up they could, arguably, be stronger than they have ever been in their history. But of far more relevance - they now have a place in British footballing history as FA CUP WINNERS - something we, and many other more fashionable clubs, have not achieved to date in our history.
Again you are presuming that you know what I would do - which you don't. Martin O'Neil won cups and finished mid-table - I loved every minute. Jock Wallace took us to an FA Cup semi-final whilst in the second division yet failed to get promoted that year - fantastic memories. Your ambition appears to be to settle for mid-table mediocrity in the Prem (actually I have no idea what you might think - just empohasising the point) - I want us to win trophies - four post-war FA cup finals without winning one - that was the legacy that I was brought up with - I'd love to see that put right in my lifetime.
But on the other hand, they may have got enough points to stay up if they hadn't reached the FA cup final. All I know is, Wigan didn't win the FA cup and stayed in the Premier League, then did win the FA cup and got relegated. You would think the buzz of winning a major cup would give them the boost needed to survive? Or did it distract from what should have been their main focus? They are attracting players of the calibre of Perch and Holt... You mean Championship players? Because they are in the Championship... Yes Europe and their recent relegation would make them a more attracitve proposition than most other teams in this league... But I would argue that they would have a much bigger pull if they were still in the Premiership
.. it's all conjecture, and we all have our own opinions - I think they were a better this season than the one before yet still went down ... that's because the Premier League is very tough ... I personally don't believe it's because the Cup made them lose focus - indeed the players were possibly trying to impress far more in league games due to the prospect of being able to play at Wembley twice - but it's all conjecture. I have my views but completely get that others see it differently - it comes down to what each of us thinks - nothing wrong in that at all.
I know, I do enjoy a good debate and this is keeping me occupied while there is literally no other news
