I agree with that, swanselona (and your point about Franco's chippy the other day ) There is a tendency for those who criticise Islam in particular to be labelled as racist and that's utter nonsense. I have Muslim friends and I bet a lot of you can't say that. I respect them as individuals because they are lovely people and their religion works for them but I don't respect the Islamic ideology and never will.
When I joined the navy, during my short stint in Raleigh, they knew I was an atheist, i marked it on my form when enrolling, yet do you know what, I was still made to go to bloody church on a Sunday. Thankfully I was medically discharged shortly after, so didn't have to suffer the stuff for too long. Although there was a good side to it, was an extra hours kip, and after i woke up, we had tea and biscuits. If i remember rightly, they offered us a couple of different options, all the same to me, i chose the one with the comfier looking seats. Best part, was when one told me it was disrespectful for me to fall asleep....no, what was disrespectful, was making me attend in the first place.
I went to a funeral recently and it was very very religious. Real fire and brimstone stuff. When I spoke to my mate later he said that neither he nor his mother (the deceased) was in the slightest bit religious. The family had just asked the local vicar to say something about a woman he didn't even know. As is usual the vicar used it as a religious platform telling us we'd all burn in hell if we didn't believe. I was appalled. On the subject of Islam, this is what happens when governments embrace a dangerous ideology. Iran believes it's their god-given duty to wipe all Jews and Christians off the face off the earth. Why? It's mandated in the Qu'ran. They don't consider themselves extreme, they are just interpereting their holy book literally. They murder and oppress their own people all in the name of their god: http://bit.ly/11aw4Qf Those who say religion does no harm should really think again.
Everybody needs to get a copy of Life of Brian - have a laugh and then carry on believing what they will. All of the conflicts in the world are based on DIFFERENCES - not religion - religion is the chosen difference. How about tribal africa or the first nations in N.America - they didn't know religion before the white man came - yet they incessantly fought because of DIFFERENCES - I worship the one sandal! Take a look at the middle east where there are far more muslims being killed by muslims than anyone - but maybe that's ok?
Sorry KJ, I have to disagree with you. You feel that Dais situation is about his freedom of speech (FOS). Although I respect your view I beg to differ in this case. FOS was developed so that every individual has a platform to air their views and opinions on any given SUBJECT or TOPIC. It was developed in order to incite vigorous debate and discussion on any subject free of personal recrimination. There's the crack in the glass KJ, FOS is constantly used and misinterpreted by individuals who think they have a right to abuse others with impunity through FOS, WRONG, There is no grey area here what-so-ever. Freedom of speech supports the right of debate and gives no one the right to abuse. Because of this I'd ban him in a heart-beat, in my view, he deliberately disrupts or stops free debate which is the essence of FOS and of our forum.
Who says that Muslims killing Muslims is OK lumber? I don't, and I haven't seen anyone else that does either. It just highlights the fact that when extremely devout people see their holy book as the literal word of their god bad things happen. You can dress it up any way you like. Religion, whilst doing some good, is one of the main causes of conflict in the world. Your example of the Native Americans is a good one. The Bible clutching hordes that came in from Europe effectively wiped out a culture that had been in existence for thousands of years. Likewise the Conquistadors in South America who raped and pillaged their way through that continent were extremely devout Christians. Religion gives extremists a justification in their eyes for the most horrific deeds. Oh, and Life of Brian is an absolute classic. If you have a sense of humour. Stumpy: If Dai is abusive then he should be banned. But my experience is that he tends to get much more abuse than he gives. I've already been referred to as a 'child' by Dilli on another thread. I let it slide because he ain't worth the grief but he'd the first to PM a mod if there's even the slightest hint of a criticism aimed at him. Glass houses and all that....it goes on here. Dai has an unfortunate manner and I disagree with 90% of what he says but I defend his right to say it. He's much less offensive than some here and most of the name calling he dishes out are in retaliation. That's my experience anyway.
Never thought i would comment on such a point. But, I am 100% atheist. I totally agree that everyone here should be allowed to belon/follow any religion they like. However I actually believe that religion is quite evil. Most wars have been started due to Religion, Terrorism is in my humble opinion 90% down to religious beliefs. It appears that if you are happy to say a prayer for someone after all sorts of attrocities then it makes it ok.
You speak like we should not speak off topic at all, should we remind you of this the next time you engage in something non-football related?
KJ no-one dcried the fact that muslims kill muslims - only christians and jews - but my point was that it's not religion - its DIFFERENCES - Sunni vs Shia Protestant versus catholic - I could go on. Also the first nations were at a constant state of war with one another before the white man - the whait man just stepped it up a notch - in the name of religion - I think not!!! Beaver pelts, gold. land and many other things not to do with religion Trundles - please think about it - given what I've said can't you see that it's DIFFERENCES . World War 1 and 2 - were they about religion?
i know i may have some strange views, But i firmly believe that Religion is probably more evil than loving. That is just my view mind you. Just dont want any sort religion near me or my family. Just to go back to something i have read earlier in the thread and Atheists having no say in debates. I have given evidence in court many times. When i have been asked my religion and have explained Atheist and asked to Affirm, I get the distinct feeling that the jurors or the magistrate dont believe what i am saying. That is only my impression and have no evidence to prove that.
If you don't mind me asking, why were you asked what your religion was when giving evidence in court, TLF? Was it relevant to the case in some way?
you have to give your religion as each person has to swear on maybe the bible or the koran in accordance with their religion. I will not and will only affirm.
I didn't realise that everyone still had to do that. Sounds like an unnecessary way to influence those involved, doesn't it?
Religion and Politics are the route of all evil. Every single problem in society today can be traced back to one of the two. We live in a world where there is a Cold War between the Christian affiliated West and Muslim affiliated (Middle) East. Religion is not defined by what it is, it's defined by what it isn't, certainly in the more conservative sectors of those religions anyway. Whilst in the West, the media proclaims Christianity to be all that is good and Islam the root cause of evil, that is far from the truth as throughout history there are endless examples of Christian bigotry with regard to Islam. On the other hand, the mass brainwashing of extremist Islam followers is equally as bad. I genuinely believe the world would be a better place if was 100% atheist than it would if it was 100% religious. Far too many wars have been caused in the name of religion.
as i said mate, Everytime i got the distinct feeling that i wasnt being believed as i would not swear on a religous book.
