Beefy's Corner.......The Off-Topic Chat Thread

Almost a moral vote, in a way.

 

I didn't even think about Maggie's Farm, I'm disappointed in myself.

 

Warnock on Football Focus: "Everyone in England wants to see Barca v Real in the CL final". I don't and I know Joe doesn't! I would rather see Spain v Germany in the final.

 

Oh, it's not the BBC I have complaint with, to be fair they were in a lose-lose situation. It's more the fact that it's in the top 40 in the first place, due to the utter sick and disgusting callousness of thousands of British people, a large number of whom were probably not even born when Thatcher was in power (or were old enough to be politically aware) and are middle-class and so weren't even effected by the closure of the mines/various heavy industries. For example, on Monday I think it was, some guy was on the news demonstrating what's in a 'celebrate Thatcher being dead party kit' and he clearly can't have been much older than about 26, if that, and from his accent, he clearly sounded middle-class or upper middle-class.

 

I don't want to see an all Spanish final either. The media love Barcelona and Mourinho and so they've decided on behalf of the Country that everyone want's to see an El Clasico final.

 

Come on PL, you can do better than that. You don't need to be directly and personally affected to have an opinion on something. I don't know any Syrians but can still have an opinion on their situation.

On top of that, please try to avoid class generalisation by the way someone speaks. Who's to say he's not from an educated, but still working class background? His family may have been directly hit by Thatcher's reign, as many, many families were, and so can have an opinion from that, though simply a basic education is enough.

 

I would like to see Madrid v Bayern. That would be a brilliant game. Dortmund v Bayern would be a good game as well.

 

I'd also add that even if he was middle class it doesn't mean that he has to approve of Thatcher as a PM. He could just believe that Thatcher was in the wrong or have working class friends/family that were effected.

 

My list of finals goes;

Madrid Bayern
BVB Bayern
BVB Barca
Madrid Barca

 

No one in England wants to see Neil Warnock on Football Focus though.

 

Exactly my order as well.

 

Dortmund vs Real for me

Edit - That's my ideal tie, I can see it being one of the most open, entertaining final in a long time.

 

So basically no one wants to see Barcelona in the final. That's refreshing.

(Dortmund v Real can't happen though. Sorry OTB.)

 

Apart from Warnock. But his opinion doesn't count because he's a moron.

 

Er, that's the semi final. Therefore they can't meet in the final.

 

Eh, after that post, I realised I missed out a crucial word: justified. Whether or not the reaction is justified is really the issue here and I don't believe for one second it is, particularly for those who didn't experience it. Of course you can still have an opinion on something if you're not directly affected by it but, for something which isn't full-scale war/murder/genocide, those feelings should be tempered by the fact they have little experience of being directly affected by it, and even if they were affected by it, it still does not justify the reaction. And you mention Syria, yes plenty of people have strong opinions on that and other dictatorial regimes. But tell me, how many people did Margaret Thatcher murder? How many protesters during the poll tax riots were mercilessly gunned down? How many miners were executed?

I suppose he could have been an educated working class person, but I'm not just talking about being eloquent, I'm talking about the whole way his whole accent which is a product of where you're brought up and who you associate with (e.g. at school). I've known lots of middle/upper middle class people (hurrah for private education) and he just screamed middle-class. Though, I could be wrong and I am willing to accept that.

Even if that is the situation in this instance, the reaction's still completely unjustified. There was hardly this reaction for Osama Bin Laden or Gadaffi or Saddam Hussein (from what I can remember) yet they did far far worse.

 

I'm not sure you fully understand how much people hated her. This women ruined entire towns completely and was the epitome of the Devil to those people. No she wasn't Bin Laden or Gadaffi, but they didn't directly affect working class english families. You have to understand that people felt so abandoned that they would kill themselves because they saw no other options. People were brought up knowing that they had no job prospects because of this woman and you can still see the effects of her abandonment of British Industry to this day, particularly in the north. The reason Germany is such an economic power is because it held onto it's industry. She lacked any compassion for the working class man.

I've never celebrated the death of a human being but I can fully see why others may have. I should add that my immediate family are lower-middle class and we all hated the woman because of our morals. We have many friends (both middle class and working class) who hated her as well.

 

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Good choices...I can think of a few apt choices too

Ghost Town : The Specials
Battle of the Beanfield : The Levellers
This is England : The Clash
And in Every Home : Elvis Costello
Don't Give Up : Peter Gabriel
The Home Front : Billy Bragg
Stand Down Margaret : The Beat

 

Yep, that's pretty much how I feel too about Mrs Thatcher's contribution, and a lot of people I know and respect feel the same.