Yet again you're turning this into a Liverpool vs United thing when it isn't. It's got nothing to do with what he's won for United and to suggest it is means you aren't thinking things through (but then that's nothing new is it). I have no time for Terry and I don't doubt his behaviour towards Anton was scummy in the extreme. The reason the fans sang about him was because they knew it would piss off Rio (and of course it would, he's his brother)...and that was the idea wasn't it? Not racism just England fans being nasty bastards as usual. To try and turn every anti-Rio chant (or anti-Anton chant) into a "race" issue is dangerous in the extreme. So as fans we can only abuse white players? If you asked me whether I think Wio was given the ****ty end of the stick last year by Woy then I'd say he probably was. This has also been mentioned in a number of posts by other Liverpool fans on this thread. So this isn't a club vs club thing despite what you'd like to make it in to. Rio has simply acted like the thick moron he is over the last fortnight. He has handled the situation very badly whether to get back at Woy or not. He has made excuses that really don't stand up to scrutiny and refused to play for his country when we all know he could have played the second of the two games at least. Did you expect the England fans to declare undying love for him after these events? If so you are even more naive than I thought....and that was very naive.
You can't crawl out of it that easily. The thread's about Rio because the chants were aimed at him, he failed to turn up to play for his country and he has been twittering about "racist" chanting that wasn't racist chanting just because it was aimed at him and his brother. Do you act deliberately stupid all the time for effect or just because you are stupid?
There you go again with the sweeping assumptions. The frightening thing about this Brave New World is that the thought, assumption, belief or suspiscion is all that's needed for FARE, sensationalist hacks, the FA and a whole brigade of self-appointed defenders of all things 'racial' (depending that interpretation is strictly white-on-black, of course) preparing the ducking stool. I will laugh though at the thought of the FA preparing a report on its fans which will (undoubtedly) say that there is no evidence to back up Powar's claims. A bit like their double-standards over appealling against sending-off bans then sending Goulding to plead for special treatment for Shrek. But, again I ask, if you, Powar, or any other of the righteous brothers on well paid sinecures have any EVIDENCE to back up your claims, produce it.
The threads about Piara Power and the chant was aimed at both Rio and Anton. You should read what I actually wrote. For me it's more about Anton but if you want to focus on Rio that's up to you. Ignores the main issue though. I have no problem with you resorting to insults as it suggests you're frustrated at your inability to score points.
By switching to Anton I assume you've accepted it's a very specious argument by Rio that any anti chanting directed at him was racist? Come on now NOF, by all means you can argue the logic that the inclusion of Anton makes it a pro Terry thing. That is totally different to an actual racist attack on Anton but this is the problem of the road we have gone down. 1) we need actual evidence that this song was sung other than from 'Mirror sources" where this all originated because its clear well before this that Holt has an agenda to ride. PP just jumped on & ran with it before checking for substantiation. 2) establishing that the song was sung is not enough, you have to prove the intent of racism before you can take action. As has been said above; people can (unpleasant tactic as it is) use his name (Anton) to get at Rio without it being a specific "race attack" Can you argue there's underlying racism because they don't care why it will upset Rio? Maybe, can you call them racists because they are mayve chelsea fans who support Terry despite what he was found guilty of? maybe. But its a whole 9 yards away from a KKK sect following around after England. As has been suggested there are far too many black players playing for England that were cheered not abused for it to be a simple racist chant. Nobody here is flat out denying there COULD have been a racist element to that already bigoted chant (yeah if you want to make it a united/Liverpool thing I suggest you stop ignoring where it originated eh?) What some are arguing is what a lot of us saw the path that would be taken if you started condemning individuals or groups based on "perception" or "insult felt" rather than hard evidence. Individuals would start perceiving racism at any criticism. Or at least deflect negative criticism with the suggestion that there was underlying racism behind that criticism. I mean look at this case. Rio behaved unprofessionally in my opinion, very childish whether it was in response to bad behaviour by Roy is irrelevant. But a couple of tweets, and a gentle nudge of the band wagon and we're talking about racism again as him as the victim rather than his behaviour as a professional footballer. The race card has become a weapon. And I'm sorry, I believe certain footballers won't be above using it.
Frank, I never said the chant was racist, not sure how many times I need to reiterate that before it sinks in. I haven't "switched" to Anton from Rio. Feel free to review what I've actually posted.
I know, I addressed your original point about the inclusion of Anton automatically making it racist did I not? And then gave the reasons why people have become sceptical of the shout of racism. On OP can I just add that I believe the continued use of PP as the head of FARE is an error in judgement. I believe his own racist comments undermine and devalue the very worthy message his organisation is trying to get out there. To spearhead a new anti racism campaign with him and Rio who have shown their own racist tendencies or at least in Rio's you could argue the same casual use of name calling without regard to its racist undertones. Pretty much what these England fans are being accused of eh?
Malcolm Y is again using the racism weapon after making his own racist comments in the recent past towards a black player because he did not support another black player because they were both black which is actually quite racist in its self. Also, just have to agree with the simple truth that black players were being cheered by the same fans and also, those black players would be the first to complain about racist chants by their own fans instead of the usual self serving FARE, I mean, if there are no racist incidents FARE would be needed less, this is one huge FARE advertisement, self serving ****s And NOF ^ Fail. What the **** has it to do with Liverpool United
Wrong AGAIN bellend. This is where you fail time and again NOF. For you it seems to be about point scoring...in fact it always seems to be about point scoring for you doesn't it. I've made it quite clear that for me this is nothing to do with Rio being a United player anymore than it is about him being a black man. Yet you still bang your head against the brick wall...hence the insults towards you are fully justified I will try again and I will try and simplify it further for you because I'm nice like that... This is about Rio because the chants were aimed at him. The chants about Anton were an attempt to wind up Rio further. Nasty? Yes. Unnecessary? Probably. Unexpected? No. Rascist? From some there may be an issue of race involved but it was NOT rascist chanting. The issue with Rio is how willing he is to label any insults aimed at him as being motivated by his skin colour. No Rio I'm sorry but the majority of insults aimed at you are simply because you're a total cock. What you seerm to fail to understand NOF is how dangerous it can be to the tackling of genuine racism to have soft arses like him labelling everything as Racism. It belittles what is a very serious issue to the detriment of genuine victims. Now I suggest you need to re-assess whether or not it is our bias as Liverpool fans for seeing Rio as handling this issue really badly or whether it is actually your bias as a fan of United that is leading you to defend a player who in this instance has been a complete prick.
Billy, I haven't really defended Rio though have I? The matter is more about Anton than Rio, I may have already mentioned that. Your Rio fixation is getting in the way of addressing the real issue. I don't think you throwing insults around is helping much either.
Well I addressed you on that NOF but you chose to side step once again. Who has the Rio fixation again? You've done nothing but repeat "its not about Rio" when in fact almost every counter post on this thread is trying to explain to you that the issue is about anybody (in this case Rio) using the race card in an attempt to deflect from his own behaviour. That PP uses it to further his own profile rather than real race issues. Anton (as far as I'm aware) has not made any comment about this. So I'll repeat, your stated position is that the chant was racist because they included Anton & that the ONLY reasons they would do that are a) just to get at Rio and so casual racism b) because they were pro Terry & so anti the ferdinands despite Terry's racist behaviour which means secondary racism or c) raging racists just wanting to sing songs about putting black men on fires. There's no other argument you could have been making with your post. Well c) was countered as the same crowd cheered the half dozen other black players playing for England. And Rio has no moral high ground on a) & b) as he retweeted a racist comment just so he could get a dig at Cole. So what's the difference? Other than Rio is your player? I mean if the media pieces were about how many black fans attend England games home & away and why the numbers are so low (keeping in mind that roughly only 10% of the population are non white and only 3% of that is defined as "black" I believe that is an area that the likes of FARE should get in on. Encouraging Rio a casual racist himself to hide his poor & unprofessional behaviour behind what at its worst is a casual secondary racism is not helping the cause.
Well it's obviously not helping you understand but then that's because you are entrenched in your view and no amount of reason will change that view even when you aren't really presenting any sort of coherent argument. Hence I think you are a complete tool. The issue is about Rio not Anton....the thread is about Rio not Anton. How hard is that to understand even for a moron? I don't really understand why you feel the need to shift the debate away from Rio but then maybe that's down to your fixation that this is some kind of club vs club thing. I have no Rio fixation. If you were willing to read peoples posts rather than just obsess about point scoring you might learn something (perish the thought). As I've now stated twice I think the initial handling of the Rio situation by Woy was poor. He said it was about footballing issues and my opinion is that it wasn't. It's also my opinion that Rio was well within his rights to be pissed off with Terry for being a scumbag bastard and with Woy for handling things badly. These issues have been raised and discussed in this thread and many others and a fair percentage of Liverpool fans have had no problem in stating Rio had every right to be fuming with the way the FA and then Hodgson handled the situation. Had Rio come out and said he wouldn't play again for England because of this I genuinely would have said "fair enough". He didn't though did he. He made an almighty mess even worse and then attempted to play the race card in an attempt to deflect attenttion away from his own mistakes. Shocking behaviour. My issue is this.....and please try and digest it so I don't have to repeat it a FOURTH time....Rio used injury as an excuse to not play for England when offered the chance to do something he still claims he desperately wants. He then flew half way around the world to earn some extra money he really doesn't need and to keep his media profile high. Worst of all however is his belief that any insult aimed at him or his brother is tantamount to racism. That is quite simply not the case is it NOF. His default position is that everything is a racist slur even before he has any real facts to hand. He then happily broadcasts this opinion to the world as if his word is god.
I don't know why the England fans sang the song, but as for why Anton is in it my guess would be this: when the Man Utd fans wrote the song they made it that someone is "put on the top" and someone "in the middle". You can't have Rio in both positions. So they probably chose Anton as the most famous closest relation. Piara Power warns us against this "subtle" racism: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-claims-England-fans-racially-abused-him.html Calling someone "******" or "coconut" is fine though: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...laims-anti-racism-campaigner-Piara-Powar.html
You said the only reason that anton was including in the chanting was racism. You gave no evidence to support this hypothesis, just an assertion that there were no other reasons to include Anton in the chanting - in your opinion. Well look buster, you and that blert Powar are the ones making the allegations, therefore what SHOULD happen is that you should prove it. It's a sign of the ****ing hysterical, Crucible-like, MCCarthyist times that we live in that you, Powar, Ouseley and Rio in his twatting tweets expect the accused to prove their innocence.
That the best you got NOF? Still, probably wise that you only type one word at a time. It will save you making too much of a prat of yourself in future and save the rest of us feeling the need to waste our lives educating you A win-win.
It's a shame that you always have to resort to insults when you've nothing else of any substance to offer. You seem to think that it makes you look intelligent which is just plain odd.
