I think he knows full well what it means, but I'm not sure that matters. He is young and stupid, and prone to do things that he will later come to regret. He should be punished but the punishgment should fit the crime. If he had been found guilty of violent or abusive racially motivated behaviour towards another indivdual a lengthy/life ban would be appropriate. If he were using his position as a footballer to incite racial hatred in others, same. He hasn't done either of those things and further he has apologised for any offence caused by his actions which he regrets. In view of this I would have thought a game or two ban would be appropriate. Of course the Greek FA can do what they like, but unfortunately the person who has made this decision has exercises very poor judgement.
As a undergraduate history and politics student i find this punishment simply astonishing. Whilst the gesture made has been, and still is linked with Fascism and in particular Nazism that was seen in Germany in the 30s and 40s, it does also have many other meanings, stretching all the way back to the Roman empire. To punish someone with banning them for life for making a political gesture is simply disgusting, and if anything, smells of Fascism in itself.
Well then your not free to do so are you? You could say your free to express yourself but then you'll be shot, thats hardly freedom is it?
if you dont know the meaning of that salute, i would suggest you have been living under a rock for 80 years.
Well he has done it, and nobody stopped him, ergo he must have been free to do it. But if what you say infringes on the rights of others, then you can rightly expect to be punished. Nowhere in the world can you do whatever you like and expect to get away with it.
lets put it this way. if i gave you a two finger salute, youd know exactly what i meant. ignorance is not an excuse.
I know you're trying to say it historically has meant different things, and even today in places like Rome it may have a different meaning, but come on, we all know what the common perceived meaning is. And as there is currently a very popular far-right movement in Greece, I think the chances are he knows exactly what he is doing.
Thanks for making a balanced argument. I think the problem is our general fear of Fascism, and even Nationalism. But can we continue to ban, and censor anything that may have been adopted by Fascist movements throughout History. For example, you would not ban England rugby fans from Twickenham for singing Sweet Chariot, however this song originated from being sang at black players because it is allegedly what they sang when they were in the cotton fields.
We can ban things that are deemed to be inciting hatred or violence. I don't have the relevant information to know if this player was actually trying to show his support for a far-right uprising, but if he was, then he was showing his support for the people who have been assaulting people of different nationalities and sexualities on the streets of Greece while the police turn a blind eye. If this footballer condones those actions, then I have no sympathy for him whatsoever. But as I say, I don't have enough information to know if that's the case. Maybe someone else does.
Just to put a slightly different slant on goal celebrations, Alan Shearer's raised arm was always a little boring. He said it was because he didn't know to do anything better : please log in to view this image
If Harry Redknapp had run around St. Mary's showing the finger to all the Saints fans, followed by showing everyone his arse, I would have found it less offensive than any player giving a fascist salute. There are still enough people still bearing the scars of Fascism and Nazism in Europe for that to be anything but completely unacceptable. Having said that, a lifetime ban is perhaps a bit on the harsh side. Why not a ten-match ban or something like that?
The excuse is obviously a lie and the ban is appropriate. Pointing to a team mate in the stands is the excuse. Which is a load of bullshit
It's only a lifetime ban from playing for Greece, not his club. And as we saw with the Scottish players, if he turns out to be good enough to play for Greece, they will find some way to overturn the ban. It's more of a symbolic punishment than anything else.
Whatever the rights and wrongs of the case, I suspect the whole thing is being blown up to divert attention from the real news in Greece. Not that I'm being cynical.
Where did you read this? All i've found is that he didn't know what it meant and had probably seen it somewhere without understanding its meaning.
On some level, sports is simply entertainment. Being able to celebrate/say what you want is somewhat akin to an actor insisting freedom of speech gives him the right to say whatever lines he wants, or a singer insisting on being able to sing badly. I mean, yeah you can do it but people won't want to watch you. If he made that gesture in a World Cup match it would offend hundreds of thousands of fans who just want to watch a football match. And, as he represents his country it would reflect badly on Greece and not just himself. It could also create a danger of rioting which could lead to loss of lives or at least heavy financial penalties both from loss of attendance and any penalties handed out. So I don't really see it as "punishment." It's just a practical matter of what Greece and their football association deems is best, and if that means they can't afford to play this player then that's what they need to do. His punishment is simply that he will never play for his country international, just like 99.9999% of the population so hardly the end of the world. That said, if it was truly a matter of ignorance and this player has no record of prior offenses I would personally just ban him "indefinitely" until such time as he does some sort of community service that will repair any damage he has done and hopefully he will learn from it and become a better person. And then I'd let him play. But it's really up to the national football organization, if they feel that's not viable given the current climate in Greece I have no problem with him being "banned" for life.
