So we've sorted the correct terminology on black and white, and the position regarding Euro-fascism BUT still no news on M'Vila's whereabouts then? That was a long read to take me back where I started! Btw, speaking as a Brit of Swiss extraction, I find it difficult to reconcile its status as the international moral icon it's perceived to be, with a very dodgy history when it comes to the laundering of Nazi loot towards Hitler's war effort. Whilst it's proximity to the Reich suggests keeping Adolph sweet was a sensible move under the circs, its refusal to accept fleeing Jews as (temporary) refugees left thousands to face the death camps. How moral was/is that? Equally disgusting has been the lack of due diligence shown in the Swiss banks' efforts to reimburse the relatives of holocaust victims, people who'd seen what was coming and desperately tried to protect their money by opening Swiss accounts in the lead up to WW2. Of course all this is easy to criticise with the benefit of hindsight but it hardly justifies the country's standing in the international scheme of things. All a bit Blatter-esque if you ask me.
A martinet who never believed he was wrong and was prone to his hissy fits when he didn't get his own way. Montgomery behaved badly sometimes as well, but was a decent general. Strong family resemblance mate.
My father nearly got killed in the war against the Serbs and now one of his best mates is a Serb. I never heard him saying anything mean about them. I even was trying to wum him asking him what will happen if I marry a Serbian girl. He said if you fall in love do it. So I guess it depends from one person to another
No doubts it was all in the interest of self preservation but not a very endearing trait in a global conflict. I was actually having a conversation about the morality of the Swiss banks the other day. Ultimately, there are dubious people in charge of large institutions the world over but certainly the accumulated Swiss wealth (at the top if nothing more) is based on a lot of turning of blind eyes.
Amazing - given the horrific intensity of the 'Yugoslav' wars. Incredible story after such a short time. Whilst there will be many who can never return from the hatred that fuelled the conflict, it's people like your dad and his Serbian mate we rely on to bring our humanity back from the dead. Big those two guys up for us will you please - and make them honoury Rs!
Mate you wouldn't believe the number of people just like them. But the fact is that those who are nationalist are louder than the rest. Stupid people speak loudest. I'm far more concerned that 15 years old kids are full of hate and act like they know everything about the war but the fact is that they've just being brain-washed
All very true but you might be forgetting one important point: There's two sides to every War. What way do Germans, Italians, Romanians, Japanese etc feel about the Swiss? The same? The Allies won the War therefore all moralising can, is and has been done by that side. Neutrality might not endear a Country to either side but for that very reason its impartiality makes it a facilitator for future conflict resolution. Because whether belligerents agree with it or not, Switzerland's evenhandedness cannot be questioned. Also, history - to a large extent - is written by the victor. The losers, in this case the Germans, despite the undeniable cruelty of their forefathers, I suspect hold a certain amount of animosity towards the sanctimoniousness and holier than thou attitude taken by a lot of people from the former Allied Nations. I wonder what modern Germans feel, deep down, toward their Swiss neighbours? I have a gut feeling that they have an affinity with them. No matter what evils Hitler and his henchmen may have committed, people will still feel aggrieved when their Country is bombed to dust and will have goodwill to those (Countries) that didn't partake in the destruction. Remember, there's always two sides to every story. As for Sweden having dalliances with Hitler. Is that true Totallyqpr? Or is it a bit of a makey uppy?
That IS good to know (the first sentence). Those Balkan wars were well documented over here and weren't just between ex-Yugoslav nations but neighbouring towns, streets and houses even. The savagery added new meaning to the word and in 'ethnic cleansing' new ways of attempting to destroy 'lesser' peoples. Whilst I understand your concerns about the brainwashed kids coming through, I'm just both surprised and relieved to learn that some / many of those involved have the will to move on towards some kind of peace and unity. As people, we're not that different. It's the only hope.
The swedes, as far as I understand, from a point of view of non-confrontation, allowed the Germans to use their ports and so on. More to avoid certain destruction than anything else. They had a certain amount of collaborators but then so did everyone. I'm sure they had a strong resistance movement too.
Trains with people from Norway destined to death camps were allowed free passage through Sweden. Probably they had little choice but...
I'm not sure they did swords as I think Sweden was effectively occupied, as was the rest of scandanavia. Could be wrong of course. The finnish actively fought with Germany but only because they'd been invaded by the russians. Perhaps there was a general fear throughout Scandinavia about the Russian threat?
A lot of truth in what you say but morality (and Switzerland's status in that regard) has to be about upholding right against wrong. Sure the Nazi (and Japanese) road from nowhere to economic success in the late 20s to late 30s had many nations and intellectuals sitting up thinking 'way to go maybe'. However, as the Japanese tore their way from China to the pacific islands, and Nazi Germany started doing the same in Europe, the moral compass quickly turned the other way. Wasn't just about self-preservation. The stuff that was going on became increasingly obvious as immoral and deceitful and plain bloody murderous on so many levels. This wasn't just a game of 'Risk' in which the winner takes all and determines the way history is written. It was blatant ****ing evil and a truly neutral party, particularly one that would come to personify all things fair, just and lovely going forward, should've had no part in it. In Switzerland's case, for 'neutral' read 'cynically opportunistic'. For that country to stand for good as opposed to evil and human right against inhuman wrong, is the epitome of hypocrisy. Whatever next, a Nazi Pope? Oh, hang on a minute... !!
