So in answer to my question (having stipulated not to bother with your pots and pans) you post up a Charity Shield, a one-off game called the "Super Cup" and an FA Cup in half a decade of Management at what was once a great Club? Come on man, you know he didn't do sh*t and all the nonsense you can post up won't make one bit of difference.
Considering Arry's been in the PL this long. Rafa walks in to get a higher finish than Arry ever managed, after winning our own to keep European cup, Arry did even manage a lofty league finish with the mighty Spurs whilst Arsenal and Liverpool fell.. yeah great achievement. Pots and pans, that's what they are when you got none. I fail to see your point there I dare to disagree, is that it?
Rafa has managed Liverpool and Chelsea in the EPL, Harry had Southampton, Portsmouth and West Ham. His record at Spurs is one of improvement and who knows what he could have achieved this year. Not really fair to compare PL finishes.
You make a good point there, one that's hard to argue with. The Spurs bloke above though does show that Redknapp's Clubs have been small whereas Benitez' have been big. I suppose you could counter that by saying that's because better Managers get bigger Clubs. I understand how Liverpool fans could get carried away with winning the CL because they've never experienced winning a PL title. You're naturally going to cling onto the one bit of decent silverware you've won and big it up as much as possible. I get that. But the League is the bread and butter of every football Club mate and you ain't won it in over two decades.
Told ya! 'Arry might have taken advantage of Liverpool's plight to get 4th but getting us to the head of that queue of teams vying to take advantage was a good job and then keeping us in and around the top 4 despite not spending much money was also very impressive. Benitez's trophy wins are impressive but it's not the be all and end all of a manager and what makes him better than another manager right now. That's Liverpool fans for you though. Bring up Rafa's trophies, King Kenny's trophies to prove that they're great managers yet there's no outcry from the fans when they hire potless Rodgers instead of trying to hire AVB who has already proven himself a winner by their own logic. As much as Rafa's achievements are great, his ability to waste money and take Liverpool backwards or turn treble winners(Inter) into a midtable side, all more recently than any trophy, shouldn't be ignored. You might not rank 'Arry's achievements as highly but he's not had anywhere near the level of catastrophes that Benitez has and if you compare both of their recent histories 'Arry can only come out best.
Really? A CL is impressive, fair enough. But other than that he won an FA Cup. That's it. If they want to talk about Charity Shields and Super Cups then by all means but they can't then still claim to be one of the Super Clubs. Again, the CL was very impressive that time. I still remember the night they won it - unbelievable. But he didn't do much else in that 5 or so years so I'm not quite sure why they hold him in such high regard.
I was including what he won in Spain. Winning La Liga ahead of Real and Barca is very impressive on it's own, he won it twice and won the UEFA Cup and their Spanish Cup(I think). What I was getting at is that he's won quite a lot and it certainly dwarves what 'Arry's won. That doesn't make him a better manager right now though.
Fair enough. Good points Yid. The one thing I would say is that winning in Spain is one thing but winning in England is quite another. Its a very different scenario as Benitez found to his cost with his abysmal record in the EPL. We signed a player at the start of the season from Real Madrid. Esteban Granero, a very good midfield player for them during his time there but he's looked sh*t this year for us (although he played quite well last night). The speed of our game is lightening fast compared to Spain and this guy has looked totally lost. One of our posters used to follow him at Madrid and he can't believe its the same player. Benitez might be a good Continental Manager but when it comes to the Premier League, I don't think he's owte special. By the way, you got me banned for a month that time ye rascal!
I was impressed with Granero too having seen him a couple of years ago at Madrid. Being brought on when the team's already winning and you're surrounded by the quality Real have probably made him look better than he is but I think he could still do well. It took us about 18 months to start really getting the best out of Modric and ironically now he's struggling at Real Madrid. I haven't asked for anyone to be banned(apart from returning banned users) so I don't know what you're talking about, I'm afraid.
Of course you didn't mate. Remember "Hooter-gate"? I apologised to you and you accepted it straight away. But some other guys that had it in for me, pounced on it and I got banned for a month. It was kinda funny looking back now!
Ah yeah, I just looked it up but I remember it now, seemed like an honest mistake. If you were a West Ham fan I might have had a harder time believing you Didn't realise you got banned for it, Peter Herbert must really have nothing better to do.
Rafa took two sides funded for low 70s points at best to 82 & 86 points in the league He understood the league just fine. If he had squads costing what Manu and Chelsea did he would have done better.
He's managed in Spain his whole career, moved to Liverpool, it was successful despite H&G and when they went everything changed players left, the arse fell out literally. We finished where we did and he went. Finish of 2nd, no he's not a special PL manager but... what is Harry who has never managed that high a finish? He supposedly had a better team with Spurs too? Noone ever said Rafa was a special PL manager What does that even mean? Is Moyes? Is Wenger? Is Mancini? Is Redknapp? Is Martinez? There is only one manager that can really have that title tbh As in a special relationship with the FA
Maybe I'm not remembering it correctly but as far as I can recall, he spent a sh*t load of money when he was at Liverpool. Far more than United and eclipsed only by Abramovich's Chelsea. Harry took a team that was bottom of the league into the top four the following season. UEFA had to rewrite the Champions League rules because for the first time in history, the Club that won the CL couldn't finish in the top 4 of their own league. Again nobody's denying his European credentials but domestically in the English league, he hasn't got it - nor have Liverpool FC since the modern era began over 20 years ago. I would say yes, they are far more competent in the English League than Benitez. Moyes operates on a shoestring and compared to what Benitez spent, Wenger actually does too!
Not true. You could argue that for last season (although we achieved top 4, so freakish it wasn't enough) and the season before we just couldn't cope with CL and league. The squad wasn't big enough to handle it. Wouldn't say that was a choke. Harry didn't trust our squad players and so ran the first 11 into the ground. Levy's fault, not Harrys as we didn't trust him (for obvious reasons) to spend the money and Daniel won't break our club by paying over the odds.
If spending much less than 5 other teams in the league yet still finishing in and around the top 4 is choking, what would you call dropping out of the title race and Champions League in November? The second half of last season was some **** up but the first half of the season outweighed that, hence why we still finished 4th.
That's unfair EC. Choking would only be appropriate if the Club really should be top 4 every season. Considering City were on the rise 2 years ago and United, Chelsea and Arsenal were the other favourites for the top 4, Spurs getting in would be against the odds. And last year was the first ever time a side finished fourth yet missed out on the CL. Terribly unlucky in my opinion. Yes they collapsed allowing the Arsenal snatch third but I don't think anyone seriously saw Spurs finishing 3rd at the start of the season. Of course not. Fair play mate
