"Strength" of the Premier League

Newcastle concede 7
Villa concede 8
Man U are 7 points clear having shipped 3 each to Reading, Spurs & Newcastle
Reading concede 7
Norwich go on a near 3 month unbeaten run (2nd only to Barca)

- The capitulations of Reading (v Arsenal and Man U), Villa (v Man U) and Newcastle (v Arsenal/Man U) there for all to see.

You look down at the league and the teams that will be safe: Sunderland, Newcastle, Fulham, West Ham, Norwich, Stoke and with the greatest respect there isn't as much quality as you'd expect. All the top talent seems to be orientated around the top 6/7 teams which has a knock on effect for the league.

For the first time in ages I actually get no joy in watching a lot of high scoring Premier League games. The lack of quality is quite despairing. When we beat Wigan 8-0 in 2010 I took great pride and satisfaction in beating them due to the fact they were a decent quality team, same with Stoke in the 7-0 and Villa 7-1 and Sunderland in the 7-2, but the despairing lack of quality makes it less enjoyable. It's like having 10 Derby County's of 07/08 in the league.

 

I used to defend the quality of this league, but I struggle to now. More and more lower level teams seem to roll over and enjoy shipping goals, and the upper teams flop in Europe (You can expect heavy losses for Arsenal and United in the CL as well). The fight that the lower teams used to have against the upper teams seems to be fading, which is so sad, and its also encompassed with a pitiful lack of quality. Its a shame really.

I agree, a thumping against a team that has played well is so satisfying, but 8-0 against Villa felt like a training match.

 

Don't be too hard on Villa they have to deal with this doing the rounds now.

THE TWELVE DAYS OF CHRISTMAS FOR VILLA.
12. Goals conceded.
11. Lambs to the slaughter.
10. Fans were singing.
9. Different scorers.
8. Goals at Chelsea
7. Shots on goal.
6. Goals on average.
5. In defence.
4. Goals from Spuds
3. Point's from 18.
2. Shots on target.
And one merry Christmas from me.

 

you have to dump some of the blame on the managers, they should be able to do better with the players that they have at their disposal, they are lacking tactically and with man management if you ask me

 

I don't know if I agree with this in all honesty.

You point to United shipping goals, but they have never had a better strike force, ever.

Villa are playing with a youth side.

Norwich played a lot of teams at the 'right time' and are now slumping again.

Now, unquestionably clubs outside the top 6 are behind on class, and that's to be expected, as is the draw of Champions League football, or at least the realistic chance of it.

Look at some of the players outside the top 6 though, and there is a lot of real quality, I'd argue more than ever before.

Johnson
Sessegnon
Cabaye
Tiote
Ba
Ben Arfa
Cisse (ok, pushing it a bit...)
Mignolet
Taraabt
Krul
Llalana
Ramirez
Benteke
Berbatov
Diame
Suarez
Gerrard
Agger
Carrol
Skertl
Sterling

Now, there's more, but I genuinely think most of the above list could do a job for a top 6 team, this is top of the head stuff, I do note a lack of quality defenders on the list.


Having seen Chelsea, City & Spurs last few weeks, unquestionably it's pace that's key, hence why Mata for you boys is a better player, IMO, than Silva.

Hence why Spurs bossed us, and we comfortably contained City.

You lads have a balance, but we gave you a game, albeit too late in the day.

My team sit 13th in the league. From the other top leagues our equivalents are Torino, Bastia, Bilbao & Fortuna Dusseldorf.

Only Bilbao (falsely though after a dreadful start) would be Premier League competitive IMO.

 

Indeed on player individual quality the league has never been in finer form. However it's a team game, and overall the teams feel weaker.

 

Not a lot of difference in other European Leagues either.
You could argue Spain has only 2 or 3 decent teams, in Germany Bayern are light years better than the rest, , Holland is all over the shop, France has only 2 good teams currently, and they're no great shakes, Turkey has only 2 teams, Olympiakos from Greece win more often than not and so it goes on.
Until the Clubs themselves decide to do something about it, which they won't, expect no changes.
FIFA and EUFA will bring in brain dead financial regulations that will make not a jot of difference.
My advice is.....get used to it, because it always has been and always will be.
At least the PL has many games that are full of action and excitement, more than can be said for the slow motion stuff in much of Europe.

 

Some good points raised their MON, do you believe the league is stronger or weaker then?

 

I think overall it's probably stronger, I reckon the mid-table teams now would easily the beat those of 4-5 years back.

I do think the top clubs are stronger too, look at the squads of Chelsea & City, people say the Arsenal squad is weak but look at the calibre of footballer in it, all that's happened is the top 3 have really pulled away, not just first XI but squad wise, and this creates the illusion of the other teams, where players have maybe played 5-6 games more , being piss poor.

We could do with dropping the league cup and having a winter break, that would even out the fitness a wee bit, but in terms of Europe, despote Chelsea & City's failings, I still think we lead the way.

The Primera Liga is a procession, Atletico are in there, then get smashed 4-1 at home by Barca, the German only Dortmund or Bayern can win, Italy, Juve walking it.

I think the league is unquestionably stronger, but that gap between 3rd, then 6th, then the rest pulls out these big scorelines and muddy's the view at times.

 

City have also gone down to 10 men against the 7th and 11th placed teams in the PL away from home and still won.

 

I think the squad rotation thing answers that, Norwich in 11th have played the same 11 most weeks, several of City's have been rested.

Couple that extra sharpness with the undoubted gulf in ability, and it's not hard to understand.

Many, many times going to 10 galvanizes a team, and they get a result, losing one player when in terms of ability you are effectively 2 or 3 stronger means little.

 

This has been a strange start to the season in terms of scorelines! The PL is still ahead though because its all theatre! Saffa the pantomime dame, yeah?

 

This league is still the most exciting but it definitely is weaker at the top than a couple of years ago.

Our midfield has gone from Alonso, Mascherano & Gerrard (at his peak) to Lucas, Joe Allen & Gerrard (who isn't the player he used to be).

Chelsea have gone from playing a world class midfield of Lampard, Makelele & Essien/Ballack to playing a centre back in midfield alongside Lampard (I know he scored 2 today but he simply isn't the player he used to be either and can't effect games like he used to do consistently). And from having a genuine world class striker upfront in Drogba to Torres who doesn't seem to be very good anymore.

Man Utd have gone from having an attack of Rooney, Berbatov, Ronaldo & Tevez to having Van Persie, Rooney, Young & Valencia which isn't half as good as the attack I mentioned previously.

Arsenal had a team with the likes of Adebayor, Van Persie, Fabregas, Nasri, Alex Song & Gael Clichy now they've replaced them with players who, being honest, are nowhere near the level of the players they've replaced.

 

Displays your complete ignorance of the so called "lower teams" such as Swansea and Norwich, please refer to us as the middle teams as in a season and a half, neither of our 2 clubs have been anywhere near the premier league cesspit of fighting it out for relegation. For starters, your blinkered views on "quality" are riddled with newcastle and liverpool players who have all proven themselves utter garbage this season. How about Michu, Graham, Britton, Holt, Hoolahan, Pilkington, Snodgrass, Bassong, Garrido or Ruddy? All are more deserving than most on that list! It's easy when youre at a big club to appear good, but when at a smaller club, that is when true quality shines through!

 

Well said Goldeneye! Your Canaries are giving a very good account of themselves this year! Regards to Delia! Love her profiteroles!

 

No need to be bitter mate, it was top of the head stuff, and I listed it by thinking of teams outside the top 6 off the top of my head.

I clearly said 'there's many more' it was never a ****ing exhaustive list, and you then have a pop Newcastle & Liverpool players, who as individuals would walk into your over-performing team (3 defeats in a row now of course).

I have a lot of time for Norwich, as do all Sunderland fans (look it up), and I am fully aware that you are likely to finish around us this season.

I love Hoolahan, think he is superb, I also rate Holt, Ruddy & Pilkington, in terms of Swans Michu, Routledge, Dyer, Vorm, Williams and more are real quality.

I am absolutely not ignorant to the 'smaller' teams, I'm a ****ing Sunderland fan for christs sake, we're hardly Barcelona.

If anyone needs a head shake, it's you, you absolute bell-end.

I assume you thought I was a Chelsea fan and were having a fit of little club syndrome, sadly, I support a club that has not seen silverware since 1973, butstill averages 40k.

Tell me, which of the Newcastle or Liverpool players listed would not improve Norwich?

 

No worries just drives us Norwich fans mental when we are told that we are relegation fodder, especially that moron Lawrenson

Just to say that our "slump" isn't a concern whatsoever. We played Man City last season and got annihilated 6-1 and 5-1, so 4-3 is a brilliant result for us. West Brom did well and it was anyone's game till Lukaku scored their winner. Chelsea game, we got thrashed by 4-1 earlier this season, so to keep them to 1-0 having just thrashed Villa the previous game 8-0 was a mighty achievement. We have played well in these games, Mata was the difference without a doubt!

For the record, I support Norwich and Chelsea, so the game on Boxing Day was insanely good fun for me

Good luck for the rest of the season, no chance in hell of Sunderland being relegated, too much quality, especially your front 4 of McClean, Johnson, Fletcher and Sessegnon.

Those players that wouldnt get into our first team...Krul (Ruddy is far better), Carroll (just awful) and Sterling (Pilks scores goals)

 

No harm done mate, and as I mentioned, it certainly wasn't intentional, was a top of the head list, you'll understand how Sunderland & Newcastle figured strongly

Please note that I never suggested yourselves or Swans were relegation fodder, as you blatantly aren't!

You could go back 2 years to before you were in the Prem (I think..) and see me sharking Wes as a signing for us, liked the look of him for a long time, and still do.

I also agree Ruddy is superior to Krul, bur Carroll I think is a good player who has had bad advice and made wrong choices as a result.

Was never worried about us going down (honest ), but glad we are getting it together now, I'm feeling confident of top 10, depending on who we bring in, having the Reading game off in week 2 murdered us, left us lagging in terms of match fitness, and then confidence suffered as we played catch up (sticking to it )

All the best for the rest of the season, Hughton is a gent, and we'll see you again next year

 

I'm not saying that individual teams are weak I'm just saying the quality from top to bottom has suffered.

Sunderland used to have Kenwyne Jones and Bent but now just have Fletcher.

Chelsea went from having Drogba to a poor Torres

Arsenal from Henry/Bergkamp/RVP to Giroud and Walcott.

Liverpool from Alonso, Mashcerano, Gerrard to Allen, Lucas and Gerrard.

Nobody will convince me the league is as strong as say... 2008 when you had a number of quality players on show and even the bottom teams could give the top teams a good game. I remembered Middlesbrough being able to turn over Chelsea, United and Arsenal quite often. You cannot honestly say that at this moment in time Villa, QPR or Reading would be capable of that. Reading conspired to lose after a 4-0 lead. In 2008 that just wouldn't happen, even against a better Arsenal side, I'd say the same for Villa's capitulation v Man U as well. Chelsea losing a 3 goal lead at home in 2008 would have been almost unthinkable.

 

I don't think this is a massively valid post mate, no offense.

Boro ploud millions into that team, indeed it nearly bust Steve Gibson, you may think of Juninho, Emerson & Ravanelli, problem was the rest of the team was woeful, hance they went down.

Would I rather have Bent & Kenwyne than Fletcher, in a flash no, we are stronger with Fletch, unquestionably.

Arsenal of course are weaker, but then City are stronger, as are Everton, as are yourselves.

Villa are a club in a long term decline, but the likes of us, Southampton, Norwich, Swansea, Newcastle, Liverpool and even QPR all have players that are way above the level of a few years back, there's no doubt about that.