Now Jol is considering giving Marcello Trotta an extended run at Brentford - I've never really seen the point of month long loans, hoping that the player will get regular games with their foster club. Add to that, all the natural problems of of the player getting to know their new team mates, a different manager's ethos and so on, and it's asking a lot of the player. And if they do make a something of a success of it what then? Back to the same old, same old at Motspur Park ? Alec Smith, who is spending virtually all his time on the sub's bench at Orient, is another case in point. Brentford are pushing to have Trotta's loan extended but it's hardly likely that Orient will in Smith's case. Instead he could have played a big part in an, at times average, U21 side and who knows helping us out at the senior level (it will be interesting to see who's on the bench covering our midfield this weekend). I won't go through the whole list but will argue that you'd be hard pushed to find any short term loan that's proved worthwhile. [David Stockdale could have been, but the reasons and the situation are completely different.] Jol's final sentence is very telling when he says, "youngsters need to develop ... before they are the finished article". No question about that but then why is he dithering about giving Trotta a decent run? Loans can be beneficial for the Club and the player but only, in my view, if it's for a sensible length of time and the request comes from the foster club. We don't seem to be handling it too well right now with regard to a number of our top youngsters.
Well we can't tell the foster clubs to play our players. The short term loan should, in theory, work in our favour (such as sending Frei to Cardiff, and when Wenger sent Ramsey to Forest(?) a few seasons back) but if they don't play - again, like Frei at Cardiff, Trotta at Watford, Smith at Orient etc - it does look a waste of time. But you yourself, C58, have said that the U21 side is a wildly different game of football to anything at senior level, so surely a chance has to be taken to send the youngsters off to get real experience playing 'proper' football? I do agree though, if they sit on the bench it is a waste of time, but hindsight is always 20-20 isn't it. And agreed, our recent short-termers have been less than fruitful.
I agree with this Bidley, it's the short term loans that I think are pointless. Of course there will be exceptions, like Frei. He needed game time at a level higher than the U21s and clearly we didn't want him away for a lengthy period - as it happpens he could have played in 10 games but ended up getting a couple of late sub appearances. For others, on the fringe of the main squad, they need a decent run. Not least to show consistency. Also if it's longer term there's much more likelihood of the foster club playing them (if they're any good). Another argument is similar to the one Bandit made on the 'Academy' thread. It's a waste of time playing the likes of Briggs, Trotta and Kasami in the U21s - for them, for the other younger players who need to 'develop' and are being blocked out, and for the U21s as a team (all you have to do is look at the results when that trio don't play). Get them out for 6 months or even a full season to 'learn the trade'. That's what plenty of other PL clubs do and indeed as we have done; for instance with Danny Hoesen (okay we ended up transfering him but he's a better player for it) and currently with Corey Gameiro.
Looking at short term loans from the other side of the tracks, for the lower division teams it gives them the chance to have a look at a player and then, maybe, look to extend it if it's working well for them. So if someone like Trotta goes somewhere like Brentford, there's no reason not to extend the loan for another couple of months or even a whole season. Maybe the point of short term loans is that the borrowing clubs are more willing to do them initially, until they can see whether the player is someone who is going to be worth having around for more than a month.
Agree with all that. I can only guess the short term thing is because our full squad is so thin, we don't want too many reserves out for too long. From that perspective, shipping a player out for a month to play some proper football, then having him back again if we need him whilst retaining the option of extending the loan if we don't, makes sense. But it doesn't always work like that, unfortunately. It hasn't, by and large, this season anyway.
Saturday 22nd December Only one of our lads out on loan got to play today, and I bet he wished he hadn't - Marcus Bettinelli had an uncomfortable afternoon as Dartford were hammered 5-1 away to Kidderminster. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20738284 Brentfordâs home match against Stevenage was postponed because of a waterlogged pitch, so no game for Marcello Trotta. It was similar for Alec Smith as Orientâs match at Notts County was also postponed because of a waterlogged pitch. And for Lauri Dalla Valle as Crewe Alexâs game against the mighty Bournemouth was also called off. Dan Burn was suspended (five yellows) so didnât play in Yeovilâs 4-1 win over Oldham. Jesse Jorenen didnât feature in Maidstoneâs 2-2 draw with Worthing
Assuming the weather doesn't do for the fixture, I'd due to see Dan Burn's Yeovil vs Bournemouth on Boxing Day. I'll let you all know how our junior giant gets on. Glad his suspension wasn't one game later.
26th December 2012 The lads on loan had mixed fortunes today - Marcello Trotta put Brentford ahead after only 4 minutes, as the Bees went on to beat Colchester 3-1 away from home. He was, however, subbed after 58 minutes (don’t know if it was a tactical or because of injury). http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20779264 Lauri Dalla Valle was also quick of the mark as he provided an assist in the 5th minute to help Crewe Alex go ahead. They nonetheless went down 2-1 away to Tranmere. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20779003 I'm sure the Captain let us know how Dan Burn got on against Bournemouth but a wee hint is that he got another yellow on his return from suspension.. Marcus Bettinelli and Dartford got back to winning ways beating Ebbsfleet 3-1 at home. In front of a respectable crowd of 3,000, it wasn’t all plain sailing for Dartford and Marcus had a number of fine saves. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20779108 Jesse Jorenen’s Maidstone went down 1-0 away to Ramsgate. (I don’t think Jesse played - again). Leyton Orient’s home game against Swindon was postponed because of a waterlogged pitch, so no show for Alec Smith.
Those bare bones don't tell the story at all, Cottager. I was quite impressed by Burn. He played most of the game at left back, moving into the centre when Keanu Marsh-Brown (remember him?) came on as a sub when Yeovil had to chase the game with 25 minutes to go. I had a better view of him in the second half - we were on his side of the pitch then, and level with the penalty box, so he was defending our corner (and had a lot of defending to do). In the first half, Burn made a succession of saving interceptions, tackles and headers, and got himself in the way of a couple of shots. He seemed at his best when Bournemouth attacked down the opposite flank to him and he had to drift inside to act as an additional centre back. In the second half, he didn't look as convincing when faced with tricky wingers out wide, but he gave as good as he got in those scenarios - sometimes making the tackle, sometimes not. In a game which Bournemouth dominated (they won 3-0), Burn was probably Yeovil's best defender (maybe I just noticed him more as I was looking out for him, but that's certainly how it seemed to me). The booking was for a push and was the only thing he did all game that could have got him into any trouble. Both teams were playing decent football, and both had some nice technical players in midfield. Towards the end, Burn was a little guilty of hoofing the ball clear at times, but that was largely when Yeovil went a bit more direct and long-ball as they chased a 2-0 deficit with just 10 or 15 minutes to go. You can't glean anything from this in terms of whether he's Premier League standard yet, but he didn't look in any way out of his depth against a good, attacking, in-form Bournemouth team. At times he looked like what he was - a centre back playing out of position at full back. I don't think I'd like to see him playing left-back for us, but on today's evidence his loan at Yeovil is going very well, in spite of the booking and the scoreline. Keanu Marsh-Brown looked lively, but didn't make much difference to anything. Do those words sum up his career? Perhaps.
Saturday 29th December Marcello Trotta didnât have his shooting boots on today as he missed a number of chances in Brentfordâs 0-0 draw away from home to Shrewsbury. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20823253 Dan Burn had another solid game in Yeovilâs 2-1 win away to Portsmouth. Starting again at left back he made a number of strong runs in the first half. although it was âbacks against the wallâ for his team in the second. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20823113 Lauri Dalla Valle had a quiet afternoon and was substituted after an hour in Crewe Alexâs 2-1 win away to Oldham. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20822928 Marcus Betinellli was at fault for the Cambridge goal as Dartford struggled to a 1-1 draw at home. He did have some fine saves that kept them in the game. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20822928 Alec Smith had another day on the bench as Leyton Orient beat Walsall 2-1 at home. Jessse Jorenen âs Maidstone v Corinthians match was postponed.
Cottager, I really appreciate the effort you put into these reports but I think you are wasting your time, mate, as I would place a bet that none of these young lads will ever make it into the Fulham 1st team on a regular basis (if ever) before being shipped out for a nominal fee. This isn't a pop at what you do, which is great, but at the policy of never promoting youngsters.
I like cottager take a keen interest in the acadamy/under21s and go there as much as I possibly can, but to a certain extent i must agree with Fulhamman regarding some of the aformentioned,who started out bright sparks and somewhat appear damp squibs,to acertain their full potential longer loans should have been made.
Well, three recent loanees (Stockdale, Briggs and Frei) started yesterday, and Kacaniklic has featured a lot this season. I think we'll see an increasing number of players coming from the youth set up in the next few years. It's true that we've been disappointing in that regard until last season, but things are changing.
It was the first appearance of the season for two of those three. How long do you think Stockdale will remain in goal when Schwarzer is back to full fitness? Let's not get carried away. Jol also seems reluctant to use Kacaniklic, and often substitutes him quite early into games. Although, I did admire the balls shown by Jol yesterday by bringing in the players I suggested should play. Thought Briggs and Frei both had good games and Stockdale's sharpness will come back with games under his belt.
Is Stockdale really a Premiership class keeper? I remember Ipswich taking a couple of hammerings whilst he was there and I'm not sure he has the ability for a permanent No 1. He's decent, but probably falls short of a regular starting spot. Our very own Steve Harper.
The Ipswich fans loved him down there, same with Hull when he went there on loan (3 clean sheets in 5 games). At Ipswich under Jewell he had a woeful defence in front of him, but I have little doubts he can make it at the club.
A player on loan who's been under the radar since his goal scoring exploits for the young Aussie team in the Asia Cup, Corey Gameiro, is due back. His loan with Eindhoven in the Dutch second division expires today (31st December). While not exactly setting the world on fire with them, he is one of our U21s (he's 20 in February) with real potential. [How could someone born in Wollogong not be a star] However, it will be interesting to see what plans Jol/Wiggley have for his further development - I'd almost go as far as to suggest it will be a very good indicator of how the Club intend to go forward with the younger players.
Wednesday 2nd January 2013 Lauri Dalla Valle scored the only goal in Crewe Alexâs 1-0 home win over Carlisle. Despite that (and other decent performances), the Crew manager is insure whether he wantâs to extend Lauriâs loan beyond this weekend - http://www.crewechronicle.co.uk/crewe-alex-fc/crewe-alex-fc-match-reports/2013/01/01/96135-32529503/ Letâs hope his loan is extended, because thereâs nothing to be gained right now for Lauri returning to Motspur Park where he could block the better prospect, Cawley Woodrow (who although only just turned 18 is the preferred U21 choice striker at the moment). Here is the rest of the âLoan Round-upâ from the Club - http://www.fulhamfc.com/news/2013/january/02/loan-round-up
Scores five on loan and manager not sure whether he wants to keep him? Madness. It's not like Crewe have a plethora of quality strikers to choose from.
U21 center back James Musa has joined Hereford on a month loan - http://www.fulhamfc.com/news/2013/january/04/musa-joins-bulls As well as giving James some competitive matches, starting this weekend, this may have been arranged because Dan Burn's extended loan spell to Yeovil is up on 7th January.
