Of course I will. And you will go on predicting disaster and being right, because we are in all probability, given our status as the 4th richest club in England, not going to win anything. What is your point?
I'll add to that - the more the fans act like whinging petulant kids the less chance the team has of doing better.
What !!! you idiot, Its a trophy that you could have won why play your strongest side if its not worth it...dumbo
I wish we were as bad as you!!! You think eight years is hard..... Try forty (not that I have been alive for all of them)!!
Exactly - even Man Utd went 26 years without winning a trophy, but their fans stuck by them. Some of ours could do with taking a leaf out of their book. As far as I'm concerned, you support your club through thick and thin, not just when they are winning trophies. AND it's when they are not playing well that they need that support the most.
But once they've established a successful trend, they've continued it, unlike Arsenal, who have regressed. United changed their position around, to become one of the most successful teams in England, the most successful side in the league, and cup. That's what you call progress and building on success. Arsenal did the opposite, and instead of moving forwards, building on our success and creating more, we went backwards, winning nothing, dropping to 4th, losing our best players, and the process of regression continues.
Not true. If you read your history books you'll notice that Man Utd had periods of success followed by barren spells and then success again. Man Utd were title winners in the 50s and 60s and then fell away for almost three decades before becoming successful again in the 90s You're looking at this from too narrow an angle. 8 years is a blip in the grand scheme of things. Like I said, Man Utd went 26 years without winning a trophy.
But one of the things that you seem to completely ignore, and why I brought up the video game reference earlier, is that Arsenal do not exist in a vacuum. We are in a competitive environment. If Man United continue to get things right and we get everything right and Chelsea get evrything right and Man City get everything right, and build on success etc, etc etc. we can't ALL win. I don't understand your logic that we must be doing something wrong, because we are not winning. While the reverse is most probably true, losing may be the result of another team doing everything right as well. Are you saying that Everton don't win trophies, because Moyes is a bad manager and gets everything wrong?
We can't all win, but we NEVER WIN. No, Moyes isn't a bad manager, because he has much more limited resources than Arsenal, now you will say Wenger has much more less resources than the other 3, which is true, but won't help your argument, because we have less money than them, but not the type of less money in comparison between Everton and Arsenal. Arsenal may have less money then the other top 3, but still enough resources to compete with them and to be able to challenge and win things. We are constantly told we have money in the bank, and in the past 3 seasons we have spent over 100 million in transfers, yet we have made lot's of average signings which contributes to our lack of challenging, when you buy rubbish like Gervinho, it is Wenger's fault that we don't challenge the big clubs. As someone said, don't spend 20 million on 2 average players, but rather spend 20 million on one world class player like Mata. Furthermore, we constantly sell our best players, to our rivals, of which they benefit, so we are DIRECTLY aiding our rivals, this is something I see you like to ignore, look at RVP at United, YOU were one of the fans saying he wouldn't do good at United and it wouldn't be a big loss, yeah, that worked out real good didn't it? United without RVP's goals, where would they be now? Arsenal have been one of the main contributors of our own demise, by selling our best players consistently, and that's not doing things the right way. When you consistently sell your best players, it's no surprise you end up never competing and winning titles. That's also why other big clubs manage to maintain their success, they don't constantly sell their best players, they keep hold of them, and make some additions in the summer.
It's not ever particularly competitive. City, United and Chelsea thrash all others in terms of finances, so toppling any of them (unless they screw things up like Chelsea last season and part of this) whilst spending a fraction of the money is a major achievement.
Btw, Toledo, if we're in a competitive environment, then you don't sell your best players to competitors, but you REFUSE to accept this point, which shows you can't really have a discussion with you, because you're so biased, on one hand you try to use logic saying this isn't a video game, but on the other, you will refuse the other fact of life, that in a competitive environment, in which your competing, and hoping to succeed, you don't rid of your best interests to a rival in that environment, but you refuse to acknowledge that, and think it isn't a big deal that Arsenal do it, RVP case in point. So there's really no point, you're just making things up as you go along, to paint a positive PR spin to everything about Arsenal.
Well, I admit I have an intellectual bias, in that when I look at the facts I don't perceive any rational reason why, in any given year, Arsenal have a right to win, any more than other clubs. I do appreciate though why there are 3 other clubs that have more chance of winning. I think you are the one who is deceiving yourself when you speak of, "Getting rid of players". It makes it sound like the club didn't try to re-sign RVP. These latest were very different to Clichy, Toure and the rest. The club wanted to hold onto RVP, Fabregas and Nasri, but they wanted to leave, and because we live in a free country, we couldn't stop them. I think you have a point if you want to discuss Clichy and Toure, but you can't apply the same argument to RVP. If you have some practical suggestion on how Arsenal could have held onto RVP, other just pissing away 25M, then please share it with us. How long would Arsenal stay in business if they had to let every player go for nothing when they reached the end of their contracts, or the end of their playing career?
I resent this statement, on the basis that Chelsea have the club world cup on the other side of the planet to play in only 3 days before going to an extremely hostile Elland Road. I would not like to play in front of 32000 angry Yorkshiremen while I was jet lagged, don't know about you.
Ok 2 points here. We did not fail to sign Mata because we couldn't afford 20M. We couldn't afford Mata because we couldn't afford to pay more than Chelsea and they could pay more in wages. Second, again you seem to think retaining RVP was an option. The choice was sell him now, or lose him later, no third option. If we picked lose him later, we wouldn't have got Podolski/Giroud as replacements.
Fair play even though Stretford went 26 years without winning the league (which a lot of their new fans tend to forget) they did win quite a few trophies in between. I totally agree with you about supporting the team through thick and thin.I saw a post on Facebook where someone said they'd susposedly had an ST for 2 years but had now given it up.They said they would get a new one when we started winning trophies again.That's what you call a real fan
The League cup is a doorway to Europe because who can be guaranteed a top 4 place besides the Manchesters? Nobody so the LC is worth winning. These cups ALWAYS throw up surprises,it's nothing new. Arsenal fans like other top team's fans have been spoilt over the years and need to show strength of character when things start to go wrong. The club doesn't need moaners and as Piskie states needs support through thick and thin. Hell I know that being a Spurs supporter since 1980. Get over it and look to the next match. What Wenger and all coaches should say after a defeat is"Ok lads,it happened. We can't undo it so let's put it behind us and enjoy our training." That way the team can move on. Screaming matches and inquests are no use at all. I was over the Everton result on Monday and roll on Swansea.
You were out played by Bradford. They passed the ball around nicely for a league 2 side and they brushed your players off the ball quite easily to be honest. You were lucky to actually go to penalties because you didn't deserve to win the game.
That simply isn't true. I'll concede that Bradford played well, but to say that they "outplayed us" is a gross distortion of what happened. One of the issues with playing the way we do is that the technique for beating us is well known and requires not a lot of skill. The worse the conditions, the easier it gets. If you play that way, almost any team has a gambler's chance of beating us. Unfortnately a lot of clubs are happy taking that chance, which is perfectly understandable. Now, over the course of a season, we do OK - but in cups, the odds are against us winning all the way through. Swansea outplayed us, United outplayed us, Bradford didn't.
