Martin O'Neill reckons Sunderland are in a relegation scrap. Does that mean we are too? Our form of late has been indifferent/poor and wins haven't been forthcoming. Injuries have had an effect for sure but we're not the only ones to have this situation plus teams like Norwich and Southampton have been able to put some results together. I know we're a second half of the season team (historically) but what if this doesn't materialise? I am of the opinion that if we lose against Newcastle we're going to be in the poop. Have we got enough quality in the middle of the park to create the spark that's needed? I need an injection of positive from someone please. COYW
Injection of positive? How's this: We knew we had a tough run of games, and were glad to have a decent cushion of points going into them. Results haven't been good, but that wasn't totally unexpected. The current run has be influenced by a 3 match ban to Hangeland (which is now over) and injuries to important players - first Berbatov, then Ruiz, Diarra and Kacaniklic. All of those should now be fit and available again. Our poor run has included draws against Chelsea, Arsenal and Everton - three results that most of us would have taken as good ones in advance. We've also drawn winnable games against Southampton and Reading, admittedly, and lost to Sunderland, but in that last game we were definitely victims of circumstance - outplaying our visitors despite having 10 men for most of the game and having to use all of our substitutions to deal with injuries or readjusting after Hangeland's dismissal. There's lots of reasons for expecting our form to improve, and all the things that had us so happy with Jol's handiwork are still valid. Form is temporary, class is permanent (excuse the cliche!). Our class acts are all coming back now. We'll be fine.
At this point in the last two seasons we've been in the relegation zone. Imagine if we go on a similar run next year like we usually do! We've not suddenly gotten a worse squad, we've been short on quality in CM all season. In January I've no doubt Jol will do what he can to address this and the CB situation.
I don't like the inconsistency I see in the results. One might say that we got good results in our draws against Arsenal and Chelsea, but look at the form those teams are in. Were those really good results? I'm not so sure. It's certainly too early to panic and use the "R" word in connection with this team, but there are worrisome questions we face. How long will Berbatov be patient with his teammates? His gesturing on Saturday displayed something bordering on disgust at his teammates lack of movement and imagination. If he gets injured or loses interested, our team will be little better than Sunderland or Wigan. How long can we rely on Hughes and Hangeland? Senderos was dreadful Saturday and, frankly, Hughes wasn't much better. Hangeland hasn't looked like his imposing, dominant self in months; he's getting older. The biggest problem (IMO) is the absence of Murphy, Dembele and Dempsey. I'd say 80 percent of the creativity this team possessed last year walked out the door with those three. And while I appreciate the competitiveness of Sidwell, Baird and Diarra, it was Dempsey and Dembele who produced the assists on Saturday. Berbatov was a remarkable signing, but he can't do it all.
These weren't issues a couple of games ago! Once Ruiz comes back we'll be in much better health. Plenty of reasons to be optimistic, we're due a bad spell, and if our bad spell consists of draws away to Chelsea and Arsenal, we're on the right track.
I think you both have a point. We are going through a bad spell at the moment and we are missing Ruiz however I still think we will have issues when Ruiz returns. I think DR makes a very good point. We definitely lack the creativity to provide Burbatov with chances particularly with Ruiz out of the side at the moment. Berbatov was quite on Saturday because he didn’t really get any service and you could clearly see his frustration. Last season Murphy and the Ds did create a lot of chances and we haven’t replaced them creatively although Ruiz is a much improved player on last season. I think part of the reason it’s been apparent the last few games is because of the quality of the opposition. Spurs are a very good site and although we held our own up until Sandro’s goal I don’t recall HL having to make a save. I think he only made a single save all game. The point at Chelsea on paper was a great point for us but Chelsea are really struggling at the moment and again we didn’t really create many chances. I think we definitely need a new centre back in January (preferably too as I think BH will move on). I love us to get Douglas from Twente but I’m not sure if that will happen now. I think we also need more creativity in midfield to feed Berbatov. You could see the lack of service was frustrating him on Saturday.
All I'm saying is, we were doing fine for goals without the D's and Murphy. Yes we lack that spark in the middle of the park but that will come. We've had a few key players out injured so it's no surprise we've slumped a little. I just think to go back and say the loss of the aforementioned players are the cause of the issues we have right now, as opposed to a month or two ago is a little short-sighted.
As Bill Shankly said (you may have gathered I'm reading his autobiography at the moment), "Football is like a piano, you need eight men to carry it and three to play the damn thing". The Sunderland game was a busted flush for us and at a stroke took out our "three players" - Hangeland and Ruiz for the obvious reasons but also Berbatov from the role he should be playing. Instead of being up front keeping the opposition occupied he's playing deep and trying (or being asked) to do too much. Also the inexperience of our two wing forwards (Dejagah and Frei) told on Saturday. Like TMHAL I don't believe we should assume that Bryan will be like the return of the messiah and as DR said, Berbatov’s gesturing is a worry (frankly we still lack a true leader). However we’ve got that bit of extra time before the Newcastle game, with everyone back, to work on our game and I‘m sure Jol will be fully aware of where the problems lie. We are Fulham and we will bounce back.
Craving, I think that C58 has given a pretty good assessment. I do not believe that we should be worried about relegation and believe that there are a teams with much bigger problems and lower prospects than ourselves. Just consider how poor Sunderland were when they came to The Cottage - In a game that that they were lucky to win IMO. And I'm quietly confident of 3 points next Monday. C O Y W
Far too early to consider the R word, but there are problems that need solving. Ruiz coming back will not be the answer to our prayers, although I'm sure it will be an improvement on how we are playing currently. Kaca is hardly a regular for us, so I'm not sure why he's being heralded as our savior once he comes back, and Hangeland has been out of form all season (although I'd still take him over an awful Senderos). If we get a new CB and CM in January, with the possibility of a striker on loan (Gignac perhaps) then we will be well clear of the relegation zone come May, if we don't, then it could be a long hard season. But until the transfer window has come and gone, talk of relegation is just silly.
LOL! And who on Earth has said that? He's been our best player on the left wing anyway, the alternatives are your mates Hugo and Richardson!
Not quite. The alternatives are one of Duff and Dejagah. Jol has already stated that he sees Richardson as a central player and Rodallega will play on the wing no matter what happens, as he is Jol's favorite. Kaca is being included in this group of players that people think will transform us as a team when they come back. He could certainly prove to have a positive impact, but probably not to the extent that's being mentioned. And I hope that last part was sarcasm.
Duff and Dejagah are right wingers, I don't think either has played on the left (although now that I think about it Duff may have once?). Jol did say say he sees Richardson as a central midfielder but he's not played in the centre yet, and I don't think Hugo is Jol's favourite at all. He clearly only played him against Chelsea as part of squad rotation, and before that he hadn't started for weeks. Nobody's saying Kaca's going to transform us, but he was part of nigh on all the teams that have done well for us this season as have Ruiz and Hangeland, I don't think it's that outrageous to think we'll look better when they're back? Lighten up Bandy!
Sometimes players click. From what I've seen, Berba does not like playing with Hugo or Richardson outside him on the left and after Saturday I doubt if he's happy with Frei. Kaca however he has enjoyed playing with. That's not to suggest we are a one man team, rather it's me saying we need to be a team; where the players are in tune with each other and in the roles/position that they are playing. So, like you Bidley, I don't think Kaca will transform us (in fact he's had a couple of indifferent games) but he and Berba click.
With teams like us it's about confidence, if we lose a few then of course we can struggle with confidence. It seems the top teams get away with poor performances and still win, or get the lucky breaks more. Think our style under Jol is more open, we are more likely to consed than under Hodgson. But so far I have seen 8-9 worse teams than us, and Sunderland have been the worse of the lot, but they beat us 3-1.
It is a matter of confidence but also of quality. We had some quality midfield last year with Murphy, Dembele, Dempsey and some times Ruiz... We are left with Ruiz who is better than last year. I am hoping for someone to come in January. My preference has always been on O'Hara, but Huddlestone or Noble would be just fine...
If we got in Jamie O'Hara to help fill the supposed void left by the D's and Murphy, I'd have serious doubts about the transfer strategy of the club. At least Huddlestone and Noble are playing in the PL.
