It's a long time since wearing a poppy was a simple mark of respect worn only on remembrance day. It's now worn earlier and earlier and is now more about the wearer than anything else.
Well I don't know what his reasons are, but it could well be religious, or it could be down to the fact that the Poppy celebration goes back to World war 1 and King George V, The Irish have no look on our Royal Family (Neither do I for that Matter) and would not want to be associated with any Military honour of the British Empire, where this celebration first came from. Yes it is now a mainly silent mark of respect for the dead, but it has roots that go far deeper, matter of fact some of the rituals involved go back to Greece and Rome. He could even Be a Conscientious objector, but what ever his reason, I'll respect it. Maybe he should have given this game a miss, but lets be honest, he would have discussed this issue with his manager and club before hand, and it's clear the club have no issue, so why should we, far more important issues than wearing a Poppy. Finally what constitutes respect for the fallen? wearing a poppy, or respecting the epitaphs and graves? how many of these have been vandalised, over the years! just my view........... PS: Norway we agree on alot of things, and I understand fully your outrage, but we have to accept his right for what ever reason, also remeber this, During World War I, many Irishmen served in the British Army, but official commemoration of them (and other British soldiers) has been controversial, to say the least in Ireland.
My Grandfather fought in both the first and Second world War, he was with the RAF, Italy, Africa etc. I had also many stories from my Uncles too, who served. But one thing my Grandfather said to me before he died, was that he would never do it again, his words where "to think my friends and mates died for what we have today, never again, I'd go to prison first"............
All good points but its about that futile sacrifice though isnt it? the fact we still remember means we will never forget the pointless sacrifice made by many, surely we can all stand together to remember the guys that fell irrelevent of what political motives there were ? its a simple gesture made complicated by other factors but the essence still remains the same. if we treat this with contempt then where does that take us? To me the whole fabric of society is being eroded, why cant we on one day of the year make just a simple gesture to remember how we acheived what we have acheived through unwanted death and bloodshed,(the ability to have a choice) it was through all this pain we have the ability to talk about it today, that in itself should be enough to wear a poppy on your football shirt for 90mins before you leave the ground in your Aston Martin and drive back to your mansion in the country. The guy represents everything that is wrong in the world, take take take and **** the rest , im alright mate dont care about setting an example and forgiving people,dont care about the dead people that enabled him to have that choice. Where does it stop? Next season we have more players "making a statement" and before long everyone ****s on the poppy and starts to talk how it is really a symbol of war and nothing else. In the meantime, the millionaire that is James mclean becomes a hero to other like minded people and we end up deeper in secterianism and politics, all because a simple gesture of rememberence,forgiveness,pain and suffering was too hard to wear for 90mins of football.
Norway I have worn a poppy, and on times I have not worn a poppy, to me it's not so much the wearing of the poppy, as the silence of respect, and reflection on those that sadly lost their lives in these pointless wars. Today we live in a different generation, and the fact is most would not contemplate one bit laying down their lives for corrupt goverments. Who are goverments going to send into battle in the next world war? their sons? or the poor and disadvantaged that know no better! Anyway we can go on, going to watch the footy Mancity are losing, and Rodgers boys are up next!................ PS: You area one though Norway!..................... ITIWRAN.......................
Dragon - Yeah, agree with you there. Anyway all food for thought, the Sunderland fans are going to let their feelings be known and i dont blame them. Looking forward to watching Chelsea V Liverpool , at least i know one team is going to be fantastic today..
The three Argentinians playing for Man City are all wearing Poppy's. That's a country we had a war with 30 years ago. Fair play to them that's a sign of true class and the less respectful out there could learn a thing or two from them. When in Rome.............
Fair play to them wearing a poppy. I were my poppy with pride and so do the rest of my family. My daughter wore my fathers world war two medals today, made me so proud that al though he's no longer with us that we can show the pride we have in him and what he did for us. I know it's each to their own, but it's not much to expect just for one day to remember our fallen. I also feel that remembrance Sunday is not just for the service people who lost there lives, but also for the civilian people who also lost there lives at home during the Blitz etc. Let's not just forget these people as well.
It's Brenda time lads, what's the score line going to be, by the way where's that DaiScouser!.................. PS: 3-1 to Chelsea!...........................
What seems to be lost here is the fact that Mc Lean has no affiliation to Britain, He comes from a nation that has suffered at the hands of British imperialism, this imperialism still exists today in many nations across the globe. The fella doesn't want to attribute money or promote this in any way. The poppy isn't a sign of remembrance in Northern Ireland,for Nationalists its a constant reminder of the hold and the mutiny the British have inflicted on them and across the world. There should be no forcing people to wear any emblems in this day and age, people should be free to wear what they want and at the same time what they don't want. Mc Lean has said nothing about the history of the poppy or why he choose not to wear it so he hasn't insulted anyone or offended anyone. He has simply exercised the right to not wear something that has been politicized specifically in Northern Ireland. If i wear to ask an English man playing in the Republic of Ireland to wear an Easter Lily there would be several problems with it. Firstly it ha no relevance to his history , it would be infringing on his rights and infringing on the freedom set out by democracy. Mc Lean is not at fault here in any way, he has simply refused to wear an emblem that he finds offensive. The British media has made this an issue and it is they who have the problem. No one should be bullied into wearing anything of the sort. People should of course remember their dead but don't expect all to honour them to the same extent. For an Irishman (who did infact have people who were forced to fight in he war) the poppy has little relevance . In northern Ireland it is a divisive symbol , so Mc Leans is totally right not to wear it and other Irishmen should join him in standing up for what they believe.
I wore my medals with pride today and attended a remembrance service and i wear my poppy as a mark of respect towards those who had fallen in my name......Ireland was suppose to be neutral during the war when they refused to join their closest neighbors in the defeat of Hitler and the 3rd Reich, They in fact supported Germany by allowing them to use Irish ports as shelter for u-boats......Irish people a small minority will not wear the poppy and personally i could not care less because it is a democratic choice something we fought for during the war or wars and as long as they respect my wish to wear a poppy as my democratic right then i will respect their democratic right not to wear the poppy,
Whether you like it or not Rememberance Day IS political and by and large serves to promote the British Armed Forces rather than a neutral act of remembering all dead from all sides of all wars (isnt the money raised donated to the Forces?) Now we can argue about the political rights and wrongs but if the guy feels that his community suffered at the hands of the British Army then he is totally right in not supporting it.
Considering that over 250,000 soldiers served there for over 37 years, with 763 members of the Armed Forces were killed and 6,100 wounded doing something they were not trained for I find it ironic that people forget how vicious that war was and yes it was a war not started by the military but by successive governments both here and in the province .The Army was called in because of the threat of civil war with the Catholic population being the under dog . The wearing of the poppy is to remember all of the fallen regardless of what conflict I went into a public-'ouse to get a pint o' beer, The publican 'e up an' sez, "We serve no red-coats here." The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die, I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I: O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away"; But it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play, The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play, O it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play. I went into a theatre as sober as could be, They gave a drunk civilian room, but 'adn't none for me; They sent me to the gallery or round the music-'alls, But when it comes to fightin', Lord! they'll shove me in the stalls! For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, wait outside"; But it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide, The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide, O it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide. Yes, makin' mock o' uniforms that guard you while you sleep Is cheaper than them uniforms, an' they're starvation cheap; An' hustlin' drunken soldiers when they're goin' large a bit Is five times better business than paradin' in full kit. Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, 'ow's yer soul?" But it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll, The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll, O it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll. We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too, But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you; An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints, Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints; While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, fall be'ind", But it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind, There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind, O it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind. You talk o' better food for us, an' schools, an' fires, an' all: We'll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational. Don't mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face The Widow's Uniform is not the soldier-man's disgrace. For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!" But it's "Saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot; An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please; An' Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool -- you bet that Tommy sees! I'm Proud to have served
