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Spurs in offensive chant row

Discussion in 'Chelsea' started by OsGOD, Nov 7, 2012.

  1. OsGOD

    OsGOD Member

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    Tottenham could face police complaint because of fans' chant

    Tottenham have been accused of "insulting people's intelligence" by attempting to justify the chanting of the word "Yid" by their supporters.

    The head of the Society of Black Lawyers says he will complain formally to police if Spurs fail to take action within a fortnight to stop the chants.

    In a statement, Spurs said their fans used the term as a "defence mechanism" against anti-Semitism from rivals.

    But Peter Herbert said this "wouldn't make sense to a six-year-old".

    Oldham footballer Dean Furman, who is Jewish, has also told BBC Sport there should be a "zero tolerance" approach and fans using the chant should be immediately thrown out of stadiums.
    Continue reading the main story

    “You can't use it as a nickname or a chant because abusive chants will come back”

    Dean Furman Oldham Athletic

    However, Piara Powar, executive director of the Football Against Racism in Europe organisation, has criticised Herbert for being naive and questioned whether he properly understands football.

    Some Tottenham fans have historically referred to themselves as the "Yid Army", in reference to the club's Jewish supporters.

    The term is used in a chant by some fans at White Hart Lane and can often be seen on flags and banners at the ground.

    But Herbert told BBC Sport: "Clearly Tottenham have a distance to travel before they learn of the offence that is being caused.

    "If you had a group of Afro-Caribbean supporters using the 'N-word', even as a 'defence mechanism', it would clearly be completely unacceptable. There are young supporters present when the chants are used.

    "Use of the word, even in this way, could be seen by some as justifying other people using the term."

    He has warned the north London club that unless they take action by 20 November, he will report "a racist incident" to the Metropolitan Police.

    Dean Furman

    Furman says there must be zero tolerance

    Earlier on Wednesday, Spurs released a statement arguing that "real anti-Semitic abuse, such as hissing to simulate the noise of gas chambers, is the real evil and the real offence".

    It continued: "Our fans adopted the chant as a defence mechanism in order to own the term and thereby deflect anti-Semitic abuse. Our position on this topic is very clear. The club does not tolerate any form of racist or abusive chanting.

    "Our guiding principle in respect of the 'Y-word' is based on the point of law itself - the distinguishing factor is the intent with which it is used, ie if it is used with the deliberate intention to cause offence. This has been the basis of prosecutions of fans of other teams to date.

    "They do not use the term to others to cause any offence, they use it a chant amongst themselves.

    "We believe this is the area that requires a determined and concerted effort from all parties and where we seek greater support to eradicate."

    Oldham and South Africa midfielder Furman backed Herbert by saying the term should not be used at all.

    "I understand that it can be used as a nickname in some quarters, but if it's important to stop the use of the word then you can't use it either way," he told BBC Sport.

    "You can't use it as a nickname or a chant for Tottenham because abusive chants will come back. The more they use it, the more opposition fans will use it. If it is banned altogether then hopefully we won't get the abuse at all. It needs to be tackled in the same way as racist chanting.
    Continue reading the main story

    “I think this is where Peter Herbert and the Society of Black Lawyers are naiive, they perhaps don't know football”

    Piara Power Football Against Racism in Europe

    "The sanctions need to be high and then it will be stamped out of the game for good. We need zero tolerance."

    "The anti-Semitic abuse is sung on the terraces and it's vital that anyone caught singing these chants is immediately removed from the stadium.

    "People will be singing those songs without the knowledge of what went on in the Holocaust, for instance. Knowledge is everything and the sooner we can get these songs stamped out of our game the better."

    But Powar criticised Herbert for his intervention. "I think this is where Peter Herbert and the Society of Black Lawyers are naive," he told BBC Sport.

    "They perhaps don't know football. To think 20 to 30 years of complex identity will be cleared up overnight is wrong. And I have to say that the Jewish community are split on their use of that term.

    "Many young members say it's a badge of appreciation and gives them pride. Some older members says that's not true, it's a derogatory term and goes back to a period they don't want to remember."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20244204

    :emoticon-0104-surpr :biggrin: :biggrin:
     
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  2. luckywerthers

    luckywerthers Active Member

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    What is Yiddish?

    "Yiddish was the vernacular language of most Jews in Eastern and Central Europe before World War II. Today, it is spoken by descendants of those Jews living in the United States, Israel, and other parts of the world."

    furkin hell the world is really starting to lose it with this racism cr*p
     
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  3. totsfan

    totsfan Well-Known Member

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    So if some one hears one black guy call another the n word like they do ,and complained tothe police,would they take action on that?,as it's the same sort of thing.
     
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  4. bluemoon2

    bluemoon2 Well-Known Member

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    This world is going crackers! You can't open your mouth these days without being accused of uttering a racist/sexist/homophobic/antireligious remark! I give up! Transport me back to my youth, when you could speak your mind without fear of recrimination!
     
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  5. King Ossie64

    King Ossie64 Well-Known Member

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    I had a similar deal with the much persecuted knob-end mod off the spud board spouting the same **** the other day.

    All I said was "Look I'd had a lovely supper and all I said to my wife was that piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah.”

    please log in to view this image


    :emoticon-0103-cool:
     
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  6. - SW6 -

    - SW6 - Well-Known Member

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    It's pretty simple **** really, don't refer to people by their ethnicity or anything associated with it.
     
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  7. Yurilly

    Yurilly Well-Known Member

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    Shut up you racist! I'm giving you until midnight to either delete or edit your comment otherwise I'm reporting you to the Metropolitan Police.
     
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  8. bluemoon2

    bluemoon2 Well-Known Member

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    I beg your pardon Yurilly but I take great offence to being called a racist ! Either your comment here is something you have written that is tongue in cheek and is meant as a joke/wind-up! If not , let me make it clear, my entire life from the baby-boomer days has always included freinds from all religions, creeds and colours! I won't go further into my reasoning except to say you have caused me great offence ! If you cant understand the comments I made then be good enough to say so and I'll try to spell them out to you in ABC terms!
     
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  9. Drogs

    Drogs Well-Known Member

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    <laugh> Think it was tongue in cheek blue!
     
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  10. District Line

    District Line Well-Known Member
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    I say take all 30,000 Spurs fans to court and lock them up <laugh>

    In all seriousness though I can understand why the Jewish community would take offence to the use of the term. It would be great to hear from anybody Jewish on how they feel about it. I suspect it probably divides opinion like the N-word does amongst the Black Community.
     
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  11. District Line

    District Line Well-Known Member
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    exactly my point
     
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  12. Lotak

    Lotak Member

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    The overwhelming majority of the Jewish community does not take offence to Spurs fans using the word "Yid" or any of its derivatives. I for one enjoy it when Spurs fans chant it. As far as I'm concerned, being called a "Yid" is no longer something derogatory, in the same way that calling a black person a "n*****" would be.
    What is offensive and constitutes anti-Semitism is when people hiss and chant "Spurs are on their way to Auschwitz". And when people combine "Yid" with "Spurs are on their way to Auschwitz" very few Jews will take offence to being called a "Yid" because very few Jews find that offensive (David Baddiel, 'the Rabbi', being an exception), however the overwheling majority of Jews will take offence to the "Auschwitz" reference because that is clearly a remark about the Jews being taken to their deaths.

    In my years as an Orthodox Jew, attending a Jewish school up until I was 18, I have never, ever heard anyone take offence to being called a "Yid"

    Source: Orthodox Jew with Jewish friends.
     
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  13. Some Spurs fans, by no means all of us, though - who are mostly non-Jewish, it has to be said - use the "Yid" tag to describe Spurs fans as a whole. it is not used in a derogatory way, and neither is it taken by the group against whom that word is used as an offensive name. Therein lies the problem for anyone wanting to bring a prosecution. Sure, if someone (it could be a Spurs fan, but not necessarily so) ran up to a person of the Jewish persuasion and shouted "Yid" at him, in a manner that was clearly intended to denigrate that person, it might be possible to argue that some form of racially-motivated attack had taken place; but where a group of Spurs fans chant the word "Yid" at themselves and as an identifying reference to how they perceive themselves, where is the crime?

    My using the word "******" does not render me liable to a criminal prosecution; it's how I use that word. The problem we have with our politically corrected society is that, in some quarters, the mere utterance of some words, regardless of context, is enough to have them reaching for the lynching rope.

    That twat of a black lawyer is really beginning to grate with me. Not because he is black, but because he is a twat who is trying to play the "black" card to raise a profile that he does not deserve.

    By the way, I understand that the Met Police have made a statement to the effect that they support the Spurs fans who use the chant, so it rather scuppers the threat. Not that it had any merit to it, whatsoever.
     
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  14. chelsea - over 100 years of history

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    Just someone jumping on the racism bandwagon.

    Spurs fans have been doing this for years, why now is someone taking interest??

    Boring...next.

    I'm suprised we are still allowed to refer to ourselves as the Blues.. being racist to feline like creatures from Avatar's Pandora and all.
     
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  15. <laugh>


    Stop it! You'll put the thought into that lawyer's head.
     
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  16. District Line

    District Line Well-Known Member
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    I said ages ago we're not far away from becoming like America when you can't describe someone by the colour of their skin i.e Black, White etc and it will be Caucasian and African-British etc <doh>
     
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  17. King Ossie64

    King Ossie64 Well-Known Member

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    What next, person hole covers?
     
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  18. luckywerthers

    luckywerthers Active Member

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    "Fee-fi-fo-fum. I smell the blood of an Englishman." a lot of us remember that from jack and the bean stalk. i recently saw a new version of the book and it said "Fee-fi-fo-fum I smell the blood of a real live man". no ****.
     
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  19. Bullet tooth Tony

    Bullet tooth Tony Well-Known Member

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    Spot on HIAG good response and says what you Yid's really feel. Ooops can I say Yid's. Sorry Drogs.
     
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