This is neither meant to be a Hughes in nor out thread but I can't fault him today. As some of us keep saying, the vast majority of the mistakes that have led to this terrible start, were made in the summer in not balancing the defence and failing to acquire a goal scoring presence up front as cover for / foil to Cisse. The other main mistake, made at the same time, was Robert Green but fortunately Hughesy managed to put that right pretty quickly. As for today, MH played pretty much the best starting eleven he could. Didn't make any silly substitutions and not a card of any colour issued against us. Reading Let's first of all have a look at our opponents. Like us, a much better side than their league position suggests. We've seen them at our place twice now in recent weeks and getting 5 against Arsenal a few days ago says a lot about their abilities going forward. Fast, fluent, lots of great pass and move - and confidence that things they try will come off. Reading FC doesn't spell either **** or pushovers in any language, so if we're going to criticise ourselves, let's do it on the basis of credible opposition equally desperate for 3 points for very good reason. End of the day a hard fought one all draw from a potential six-pointer is neither surprising nor disastrous. Hard to swallow for partisan fans eager for their first win maybe but we really shouldn't start firing from the hip or lip on sheer disappointment alone. Green Shoots I've just read a fair few posts on the anti-Hughes threads. Not too much to argue with there except for the general inclination to say points equals prizes and in that sense, Mark Hughes would have little to moan about if he did get the push. But I see why TF's so reluctant. There aren't any obvious replacements that would both guarantee survival AND contribute to our overall development plan... and green shoots ARE there to see if you can take your eye off the league table long enough to take notice and appreciate what's really going on. The Rub But today's performance highlighted exactly what's holding us back beyond our obvious limitations in defence and attack atm. Rub of the green that's what, plain as day. It's that frustratingly awkward place between negative circumstance and positive potential. The place that says the best laid plans of mice and men are just bound to turn to **** at every turn - and for no particularly obvious reason! It's invariably a process you have to go through when recovering your confidence. Personally, I don't have an issue with any of the players on the park today. Some better than others naturally but there's a hill to get over as a unit - and just as it seems we're about to make the summit after which its plain sailing all the way, something in the interplay fails and we find ourselves rolling backwards again. The only answer when that happens is to keep your collective pecker up and try, try and try again until it all starts coming together on its own. Anyone who's played team sports will know the difference in your luck when things are going well or badly. Ball either drops neatly on your foot and immediately under control or somehow hits your shin and bounces away at ridiculous angles leaving you looking like a right wally! That was the difference between us and Reading today. Despite similar league points, them 'Fakes' remain a unit with a little more unitary confidence from better results than us so far. Hughes' Hard Work Done As Swords acknowledged in his OP on his Adel Taarabt thread, Hughes seems to have recognised the things in certain individuals (Taarabt, Hoilett, Cisse, Hill and one or two others) that needed straightening out one way or another. By having the balls to bench them for a while and bringing them back in as soon as the opportunity arose, he's got their attention and we're seeing much better team performances from each of them - all game long. That's the bigger part of the green shoots I'm speaking of. In this sense, and in terms of discipline, Hughes has got a lot of the hard work done. Interesting to note too that another of our criticisms of Hughes appears to have been heard on the front line. Whilst Hughes himself still looks poker faced with a low pulse rate (doubt that'll ever change and 'Arry hardly looks inspirational at the best of times!), the team as a whole certainly look up for it and passionate enough to me at least. Always thought we'd pick up after an awkward start today - and we did. It's just always going to be difficult to mince the mustard when you're so obviously lacking the cutting edge up front we all keep bemoaning. Having said that, Hughes appears to be addressing that too, in the only way he can: more midfield firepower coming through from the likes of Taarabt, Hoilett, Mackie and Granero. If we can keep that threat developing it'll take a lot of pressure off our defence for sure. The other key ingredient is Cisse. Another slow and awkward start but as the game went on, started to recover his focus, less offsides and increasing positive performance. Great for his confidence that he was finally able to tuck one away! All good then - barring the necessary rub of the green? No, not at all but there ARE green shoots and you don't need rose tints to see them. Risky Business So when's THAT win going to come and will we really survive? Who knows but one thing's clear, a change of manager now is far from the be all and end all we're inclined to think it is. One way or the other there's a major risk involved: keep Hughes, stick with the long term plan and hope it'll all come good in time to save us; or let him go - and start again with someone else who'll have a fair old job re-focusing the players. I think Fergie went through this kind of **** during his first FIVE YEARS at ManU and the faith in his unique abilities paid off handsomely in the end. Not saying Hughes is in that category, since his initial record is nothing like as good as Fergie's was in the Aberdeen years, but managers learn as they go and we'd be as daft as we think Hughes is to write him off altogether. Sorry about the ramble - but the Hughes situation is far too complex to give it the simple Briatore 'in, out, in out, shake it all about' response. My conclusion at this stage, is to go with the flow and pray it doesn't take too long to recover the rub of the green. One all against an up for it and able Reading side is as good for us and Mark Hughes as it's bad. I know it's probably not the best of times today, but anyway, your shout!
My eyes are too sore to read all that at the mo, but if you're saying we're unlucky , I'd agree. But every team that gets relegated says its unlucky.
I think that's a very eloquent post Brix but I think you're being overly generous to Hughes. Our season shouldn't be down to the 'rub of the green' we should be shaping our own destiny which we patently are not He created many of our current problems and when are best players include taraabt mackie hill etc who were here before Hughes says a lot to me Yes Caesar & granero are here due to Hughes but at this rate they'll be long gone by may I see very few green shoots just inconsistent performances and poor excuses
Always the voice of reason brix. The rub of the green can't really be used over a 10 game period though.
Sorry, but no, I disagree. If the logic above is that we may as well stick with him even if it means relegation then its equally, if not more, valid to say let's change the Manager and try to change the luck. You make your luck in the end. Hughes has proved he can't get this group of players to perform. That's his job and he has failed. He has to go, quickly.
Good post Brix but what about addressing the issues that are plain to see 1: the inability to defend a ball hoisted into the box 2: the inability to hoist effective balls into opposing boxes. Today's game for instance every time the ball was pinged in the box their was uncertainty Which must stem from poor positioning/technique. I lost count of the number of our crosses that didn't beat the first man or magnetically landed on a reading players head. That is not bad luck. These are the basics and need to be drilled into the team. I'm not a Hughes out yet but I do wonder what they are doing in training
Fair comment lads. If a battering's about to come my way then so be it - but without a surefire replacement around this whole thing's a very risky business. Having thought about it long and hard, the only people even more desperate for results and survival than us fans, are TF and Mark Hughes. They're the ones who's reps will take the brunt if the plan doesn't work out. As fans, we're used to it!
Brix just on his inability to fashion an away win ever under his stewardship is reason enough for him to go That almost means half of our season is a write off already Also I heard today this is our worst start to a campaign since 1920. These facts are shocking and he is clearly not up to the job at all
Talking of 'Green', did anyone see Rob Green's reaction to our equaliser? Hardly jumping up and down with relief!
Sorry Brix, have to disagree regarding our performance today. In the first half of one of our most important games against major relegation rivals we were seriously second best. They won all the 50-50 balls were half a yard quicker all over the pitch and looked up for it, very similar to the West Ham game, half the match gone and we were staring at another humiliating defeat. We improved in the second half but were far from dictating all the way through and any time Reading broke forward you were waiting for a mistake to drop us in it, if we feel like that watching what do the players feel like? In the end we could have won it but didn't, that's rub of the green, but overall we can't complain about just a point, it's all we deserved. The problem is, ten months later we are no better than we were, green shoots here and there seem to get trodden on as soon as they appear (Chelsea and Spurs) and it's one step forward two steps back. Why is Faurlin sidelined? One of our most gifted ball players and regularly topping the PL tackling stats yet not good enough for a bottom three side. If we were playing well and losing unluckily you could argue for MH but we're playing so poorly at vital times that something clearly is amiss, the body language of the players tells a story and it ain't pretty, leave it another two or three games and relegation will be a formality. After never expecting to see the Premier League again for so long I don't want us to sleepwalk back down...
I can't see how it can be riskier trying someone else than Hughes as his record is frankly laughable I'd go for a gallen & Derry combo frankly. They know the squad and the club inside out. If they achieved another 4 points in 10 games they would match Hughes
A few issues with your post Brix, Firstly, I don't think Reading are any great shakes. They are a Championship team playing with the big boys, I don't think they are as badly off as we were this time last year, but there's not a great deal of quality there. Yes, they scored five against Arsenal, but also conceded seven! As for our team, Faurlin should be the first of second name on the team sheet for me, not to even get on the pitch at all is just plain criminal. Ferdinand simply isn't good enough, and Bosingwa today was awful, his crosses always hit the first man and I lost count of the amount of times he gave the ball away.
Faurlin v Diakite's a difficult call at the best of times Andy. Good that Diakite avoiding getting carded for once!
Yep. Noticed that. Sulky (rich) bugger. Anyone else would hold their hands up for their mistakes. Oh yeah, he did that didn't he, and dropped the ****in' ball!
I've said before, I'm OK with your club but I loathe your manager. Sadly for you, I think Brixton has a serious point about a replacement. Whoever it is, at this stage, under these circumstances.........it's a bit of a lottery. Add to this the expense issue - getting rid of Leslie (unless he decides to go...is that likely?) will cost a lot. Bringing an 'arry in would cost a lot (he knows KJ too). I think you need to invest in a young, up and coming manager for the long term. You need him to appreciate some of the less glamourous assets - Mackie, Traore etc and hope that that keeps you up. I don't believe Leslie will.
