"Beefy's Corner".......For all off Topic threads

I have to say FLT I agree. I kept away yesterday because he was really getting under my skin. Feel better this morning but he does genuinely seem to have driven a few regular posters away. Apologies from me as well if by replying to some of his more moronic posts I've encouraged him.

We should not let him win though. This is a good forum let's not let one person ruin it!

 

I did try that one, bloody impossible for sure!

 

Which games have they discontinued? To be fair, Frontierville was alright, although I haven't played it in about 2 years.

 

Woah. 1 tonne, 21 foot crocodile caught. Look at the size of it!!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-14800269

 

That might result in handbags on here, snap out of it.

 

http://www.footballfancast.com/football-news/everton-and-southampton-set-to-bid-for-keeper

 

Can't see us having him and Gazza personally.

 

Aww poor Robbie.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/socce...l-brand-robbie-keane-just-061916645--sow.html

 

I did have a chuckle at that earlier. Robbie might want to have a word with the PR people.

 

I have been reading, with great interest, people's thoughts on race, class and education across several threads over a period of time and thought that it might be useful to add my own particular subject knowledge to the debate without taking any more posts any further off topic.

First of all, I am university educated. This is not a boast but a pertinent fact. Personally, I think (from experience) that most university students are foolish, money-wasting, hard-drinking, womanising toffs. But then I am also working class and had to work hard to afford University. You see, I am slightly bigoted against rich, free-loading students. I am also bigoted against black gang members and white gang members and, to be honest, anyone wearing a hoody. Is this because I am a bad human being? No. It is because I am an honest human being. We are all pre-programmed, bigotted fools. Sorry.

One of the primary areas of debate seems to be "what constitutes racism"? Well, as the holder of an English degree, the one thing I truly know is that WORDS do not make anyone racist. Racism is attitude - and to be a racist is PERSITENT racist attitude being expressed outwardly. A single slap on my child's bottom does not make me a child abuser - but persistent slapping does. Language itself is a shell. A hollow vessel that carries with it our intended message, plus a little of our psychological underbelly. It is then translated by the listener - who takes the hollow words, contextualises them by the events and conversation they occur within, adds a little of his/her own psychological underbell to it and then decides what it means. A difficult transaction - and more complex than people want to believe.

So, when I want to communicate with someone that I am unhappy, I will say "I am unhappy with what you did." My unconscious laces it with emotions I may be trying to cover. I may quiver, for example, and the listener hears "I am unhappy with what you did." Now, they must translate - do I mean unhappy as in sad or unhappy angry? Do I want an apology or to be left alone? Why did I use that tone?

Now, let's complicate this a little: I want to communicate that I am unhappy. That person is black and they have done me great wrong. As a child I heard black insults and jokes and KNOW they are wrong. I am upset and under pressure. My unconscious mind still wants to lace my words. An insult rises unbidden to my lips. The words "twat" emerges. "I am unhappy with what you did you twat!" I have managed to resist the powerful impulse to taboo (the urge to go where we shouldn't) and just be rude. However, what if I am under great pressure? What about if I feel threatened? The urge to taboo may overtake me. The word "black" (the most frightening word for me) may escape. "You black twat". A racist outburst - but from where? From the everyday me or from the primitive, frightened me? I am a victim of the socialised taboos of my unconscious and something I know is unacceptable has passed my lips. To some of you I am now damned as a racist - to others I am a human who made a mistake.

Now, to football. As a regular sunday league playing guy, I know that this stuff happens all the time. But, as some of you have said, it is meaningless if we can be human to each other after. We have all called our teammates (and friends) all the names under the sun when they cock up. We are under pressure. Our unconscious is on top. But afterwards? Afterwards we shake hands, hug, laugh it off. We know the words do not make the person. This is what I love about football. It is a game for men who are fired up and care. It is only when someone chooses to decontextualise the words, and take the pressure from the situation, that anyone can really judge a person by a few words during a game.

The kind of people who make these allegations so readily are reactionaries and not realists. But then I would say that because, as I mentioned, I am a little bit of a bigot sometimes.

Sorry to write so much - and so little of it directly football related!

 

Interesting perspective, I understand your point that everyone has prejudices of some kind of another, but I can honestly say I have never felt the slightest urge to use a racial epithet against anyone, no matter how frustrated I was.

I also take issue with your prejudice against hoodies, I am as far from gang membership as anyone and I frequently wear one. They are comfortable ok!

As for your assertion that you can't be a racist if you only say a racist thing once (or even if you hold racist opinions but don't air them), well I can see where you're coming from but I don't think I agree. Racism is attitude, but it doesn't have to be persistent and expressed outwardly. If you allow racist thoughts to cloud your judgements then you are a racist, whether you express those thoughts verbally or not. And frankly a single slap can make you a child abuser, depending on the circumstances, just as a single instance of racism can mark you as a racist.

However, it's not necessarily your fault if you hold prejudicial views and if you're aware of your own prejudices and are able to compensate for them, then you have nothing to worry about. I guess, as you say, everyone has prejudices of some sort, but a degree of empathy is all that is really required to expunge them. Some people seem to either be unwilling or unable to change their views though. I suspect it's usually the former.

 

A bit like pontificating...................

 

Stop it you'll go blind.

 

I think that, by the end of your reply, you are actually coming in to line with my thinking. The ability to compensate for feelings and prejudices is what makes us good people. Simply not possessing those feelings proves nothing at all (except, to me, an inherent lack of self-knowledge). Everything we learn, we hold on to. Not just the good stuff. Our mind harbors these things and they CAN come out when we are angry. That doesn't make someone pre-disposes to that way of thinking... Perversely, judging someone on one action or one statement could also be seen as prejudice - which is why we can't read the newspaper if we are on a jury!

I also have issues with the word "racist" as it has become a thing of myth. That means (if you read your Barthes) that the thing has become much greater - culturally - than the reality. In essence, a racist has become aligned with the devil to a far greater extent than a homophobe or a woman hater. It is unnaturally elevated so that the tag no longer relates to the crime. Someone loses their temper and uses a race word is now worse than someoone losing their temper and threatening violence. How can this be? Only one directly damages the person.

I need to add in, at this point, that I do not approve of racism and am horrified at genuine racism (as seen in Serbia of late) but think we all need to take a pinch of caution in how we categorise people. I am not one action nor one utterance. You cannot judge a book from a random sentence within it.

 

[video=youtube;TmThV22qvPU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmThV22qvPU[/video]

Does this do anything to alter your opinion on black gang members?

 

Just seen this....


[video=youtube;7AdICcfG8RQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7AdICcfG8RQ&noredirect=1[/video]

 

I think you misread my post. I said I am prejudiced against them - not that I have any particular views on them. Also, one video would not really sway me against the weight of experience (wherein I have seen muggings, heard about stabbings, been intimidated by black and white gang types both here and in London).

Prejudice means pre judging. Who doesn't do that to some extent? Saints and fools.

 

Offside!

 

Definitely offside - there was no dog between the postie and door when the letter was played !

 

[video=youtube;y7hRKSRkyfs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7hRKSRkyfs&[/video]

american politics in a nutshell