If Suarez could finish he'd be miles out in the lead as top scorer. He's created more chances or had more chances on goal (I imagine most created by himself) than any other player in the league. If he eventually finds his shooting boots he'll piss all over every striker in the league.
Dude. You're mixing Suarez up with the ''White Pele'', the ''White Pele'' could score 10 goals in 8 games, and then not score for 12 games. He's the one that scores in clusters. I also reckon you're mixing up Liverpools lack of fire-power as a whole with Suarez' overall performances. Suarez has been a revelation since he arrived. I stand by my statement, if Suarez is over-rated, then the white pele is rubbish.
I think all strikers go through these dry periods you mention. Rooney can score goals but also creates for others too. He benefits from having Van Persie to assist and to supply or even the likes of Hernandez or Webeck, playing just behind them. Suarez may score goals but he does not do it in enough matches and in such a regular fashion as to give you 3 points frequently. You might say it is not his fault but if he is the main goal scorer in the team then he is not scoring enough to pull you up the table
This takes me back to day good old days of Gerrard v Lampard. I used to often sway swap them round, what would Lampard do in the Liverpool team and what would Gerrard achieve at Chelsea? for me, this made a big difference. Lets try saying the same for putting Suarez in Rooney's position at Man Utd, what would happen? Would Suarez score and assist less goals? Or would he get more goals and assists with him having better players around him? I am not trying to compare Suarez and Rooney (good god I don't want to go there), I'm simply pointing out that you can't compare their stats quite as simply as you make out because ultimately it is a team game and a players performance depends on their colleagues as much as themselves
To answer your questions: Your response brings something back to mind. I know it is a generalisation but it is said that a good player might shine in a lesser team but put him in a big team he may struggle to adapt ("big fish in a small pond" scenario). I mean no disrespect to Liverpool but I think you seem to allude to that by intimating that players around Suarez are not as good as those around Rooney. Downing and Carroll provide some possible examples. Downing seemed an excellent player at Boro and I presume that is why he was bought. The same with Carroll. he performed excellently for Newcastle. But when they were brought in to perform in a bigger "pond" than their previous ponds, they couldn't do it. Suarez may well adapt and play even better in the United team than Rooney. I do not think so. But would he as a smaller fish deliver in a big pond? Even in your set up, if Suarez was no longer top dog in your front line (if by some magic you manage to get some of the world top strikers in), will he produce the goods? Will he share some of the chances he is currently fluffing with others who can deliver more? Doubt it.
Your thoughts at International level then? Suarez has shined for Uruguay with great players around him, Rooney on the other hand has looked as equally mediocre as the standard around him for England
Brilliant response. Not only does Luis Suarez have an exceptional goal-scoring ratio for Uruguay, he also supplies the bullets for Diego Forlan. So that answers that question. Yes he will create and score in equal measure. Would Suarez' performances suffer if he was at a bigger club? Well to answer that, well he would have to join Real Madrid to be at a bigger club than Liverpool. There is no club in England bigger than Liverpool, the reason being Liverpool being English footballs most decorated and English footballs most successful in Europe. 11 European trophies to Manchester Uniteds 5, United being second proves that.
I don't want to label you with the stereotypical accusation of Liverpool fans looking back into history I think we will have to agree that currently United is a better team with more success than Liverpool. Bigger in terms of finance, Support, Premiership titles. Let's focus on the current situation Gerrez was the one who alluded that Suarez comparison with Rooney could only be done if Suarez was playing in a similar better team than he s currently playing in. The current league positions and performances indicate that. As for Rooney at international level, it seems that the quality of players around them counts. The international team Rooney plays in (England) does not have as good players as united. England does not have the quality of a Van Persie, a Vidic, or any of the wingers . Rooney is frequently rubbish with England but Suarez is better with Uruguay. Reason: Suarez has better players around him at national level than at club level.
Are you not then contradicting yourself or being a "stereotypical Manc" You do not believe Suarez with better quality players around him & I'm prepared to say such as at united or city(league position doesn't lie) would get even more goals & assists? ( he may still have a poor conversion rate but even more chances at that % means more goals) Yet Rooney when playing with poorer players around him creates & scores less. One rule for one but not the other is illogical. This is of course talking simplistically & not what formation or style each team plays or suits the players more. I think you're trying too hard to fit in a dig in an area it just won't fit. Edit: sorry, read one post, quoted the next, you appear to have changed your mind between the 2.
Lets look at it another way with the use of rubbish players. In the 1980s Bryan Robson carried a rubbish Manchester United team for 11 seasons.(1981-1992), thats when he was fit. In the 2000s Steven Gerrard did that with Liverpool. If Rooney is as good as some are making out, as he is vastly superior to all the players he plays alongside for England. Shouldn't he be carrying them instead of disappearing in as many international tournaments as champions league finals? Its not really the players that Rooney plays alongside for England that are mediocre...Its Rooney the bottler/choker thats mediocre. He had the potential to be world class, but hasn't and won't fulfill it.
Slightly disagree there. I'd go a bit further. We've singled Rooney out but I think it could be levelled at any of the Golden generation of English footballers. Looked world beaters in club colours looked 2nd class together as a unit under a number of managers with different approaches & styles. Says to me they aren't world class players (very good of course) on their own & its highlighted when you stick a bunch of them together. Again this is all too simplistic. Suarez like Cole (Andy) has a poor conversion rate in the PL. He got more goals in Europe & at international stage because he gets more protection from referees to do his stuff while gets the opposite in the PL (not debating the why of that here). He's not getting barged as much while shooting on the international stage because he'd go over & get a free kick or penalty (like all those other players do) so defenders stand off more. Unless the refs change their attitude in the PL (not saying they should) his conversion rate will be lower and we just have to live with that. The real question is why under two different managers with attacking styles the rest of the team aren't chipping in enough goals to make this debate pointless.
This still doesn't answer the question on why Rooney disappeared in 3 champions league finals. If he is so good, he would be a big game player. He isn't though.
I agree. I don't think he's world class. I think the comparison was for the sake of comparison only. Could have picked anyone who scores lots of goals in a good team to compare with Suarez. I went with it to stop a Manc vs LFC downward spiral that usually happens to a topic.
Lets compare Suarez to Peter Beardsley who played in one of the greatest ever forward lines of all time when he played alongside John Barnes and John Aldridge. Peter Beardsley was a big fish in a small pond at Newcastle from 1984-1987. When he joined Liverpool and apart from the first 4 months, he was marvellous alongside better players. So would Suarez succeed or flop alongside better players if Liverpool signed them? I reckon he would succeed in the same way Peter Beardsley did. Luis Suarez in my opinion is as close to ''Peter the great'' as you are going to get.
Mmmm. I'd hold off on that one until he does with Liverpool what Peter did. As I said earlier putting the best players in the world around him will obviously up his grand total of goals & assists because 12% of 400 chances gets double 12% of 400 chances. You'll also find that better players will make more use of the space & panic he creates rather than just watching him to see if he does it all on his own. He'll improve with age & experience but he can not be relied upon the same way RVP was for arsenal: he's just not that type of player & we are not setting the team/system up to accommodate that. Again; its about time others start getting on the score sheet more which IS what this system/style of play is suppose to encourage. And once more; its a debate about nothing: he's on course for 20+ which is perfectly reasonable for a striker.
