I received an e-mail from the Fans Trust board today...if you are a member you would have received it as well. They are calling for the PASB elections to be aborted and they give nine reasons why. In their list are these reasons ......information limited to online fans only........one interested supporter was banned from the discussions.......all fans being able to vote has been scrapped.......voting forms are being sent out,amongst the junior fans there are many below the age of five. It does seem that there is a power struggle going on here....the Argyle Fans Trust seem to be concerned that they will be sidelined when the PASB comes into being.......there are those that say that the Trust and the PASB should amalgamate even before the PASB come into existence. The Argyle Fans Trust was set up by the fans when the Club was in dire straits....Chris Webb was involved. PASB already has changed it's name before it has started, it was the Gas Board originally which obviously was short for the Green Army Supporters Board,which brought the odd smile as an appropiate abbreviation. James Brent came up with the PASB idea and offered the chance of purchasing 20% of Argyle to it......it seems to me that certain people have brought pressure on the Fans Trust....those that prefer PASB.....and ironically surprise surprise that seems to include leaders on PASOTI and possibly the old Fans Trust Leader as well Chris Webb, who of course is PAFC President. This is just one of the hassles that is going on at present in the happy land of Argyleville.
I got my voting paper a couple of days ago and so far haven't filled it out. I have no idea who the people are who are standing for election and have largely kept out of the politics going on. What some fans are saying is that there is no need for two organisations. I think that is probably fairly obvious to everyone. The Trust was brought into being whilst "the struggles" were going on and played a decent part in outing certain parties and bringing pressure to bear in the right places. A lot of people seem to think that this organisation should be the one to continue and the creation of another Board is unneccessary. However, the reason the new one is favoured by Brent is that he controls what they can and can't do and is overseer to the elections. Webb is in favour of the new set up rather than the old even though he was a founder member of the Trust originally. People say this is because he needs to keep in with Brent and is becoming his PR mouthpiece rather than independant in exchange for his title and a seat in the Director's Box. I have no idea if this is right or wrong. Newell, who is I/C of pasoti despite denials, is another who is pushing the new organisation again in exchange for a position. Between them they are charged with waging a campaign against the Trust to blacken the characters on the Trust Board and rubbish what the Trust can do. Sounds all very Deck of Cards to me. It is true that all season ticket holders, no matter how young, have received ballot papers and can vote. I have to say that I'm rather surprised at this and wonder at the legality of it. I read a post by somebody whose 4 year old got a ballot paper. It is blatantly obvious that the father or mother will use the vote and anyway, how can a child of that age form any sort of view on the politics of it all and exercise a vote that is reasoned. It's all very strange. From what I have read, and I've tried hard not to read too much, there is an opinion that Brent wants the Board because he can control it and feed it tit bits in exchange for the cash from a 20% sale of the club. This is a fifth of the club without may I add any sort of voting rights. In other words you give Brent the money in exchange for no input and precious little else. Brent says it is giving the supporters an opportunity to have their say but somehow I have my doubts. My son has taken a lot more interest in all of this than I have so I may well have a chat to him before deciding whether to bother voting or not.
Ageists, why shouldn´t the kids get a vote they probably have an as well informed view as many others who will be voting. The majority of the vote will be based on my mate told me to, I know him, he sits near me or some other such well thought out and reasoned arguement.
It's hardly practical to allow all "fans" to vote. I lived in Exeter for several years, would I have got a vote? It's open to all to join one or the other of the qualifying bodies isn't it? The GASB isn't the Trust and the Trust isn't the GASB. The GASB is presumably going to be an official or semi-official part of the club structure. Does the Trust want or indeed is it able, given its constitution, to give up its independence and morph into that? Brent is perfectly at liberty to set this up how he wants - it's his company and club after all. Unless there's a serious flaw, which I can't see, then rather than bickering about the details, people should be focussing on his essentially well-intended motives. I can well see he doesn't want to be having to do the circuit of 101 different supporters' bodies glad-handing each one and getting 102 opinions in return. He wants a small group of individuals, as validly representative as possible, with whom he can do business efficiently and transparently. It would be helpful if fans assisted in that and stopped putting their own desires first.
notDistant I've found out who you really are.....I'm sorry Mr Brent if I have not taken your thread replies seriously enough, I shall treat you with the respect that you deserve in future.....and feel honoured that you post on our little website. Seriously I do think that the Trust should be independant of PAFC.....it's just disturbing the way that it is continually being attacked by certain lowlife that want to undermine it. Thats how they see life,uncomfortable with any form of opposition with maybe other views than their own.....just like the website that they are part of and control.
I'm not up to speed with the Bulletin-Board Battles Plymborn and certainly the Trust seems like a very worthwhile organisation. But the lowlife aren't Brent's fault.......
But he does seem to ignore the fact that they are lowlifes notdistant and you can't tell me he is ignorant of the behaviour of a couple close to his Director Box seat who he has allowed in there. I guess you don't look at the other two sites very often and probably don't look at ATD at all. The goings on are both pathetic and disgusting waged in the main by one person and known about by a close ally of his who has a title within the club. It is not a wonder that people are sceptical with the undermining of the Trust and it's Board that have gone on. It makes people believe that Brent himself is happy with this course of action to ensure he gets his GASB that he favours. You would think Argyle was more important that the United Nations the way things are done by some and not a two bit League 2 football club.
If that is actually the case Sensible then it's despicable. You are right, I very rarely visit either site. I know the person who has a title within the club of course and I've previously stated my severe reservations about public sector trade union officials generally, I obviously had and still have no direct evidence one way or the other about the specific person in question. However, my reservations were particularly about the downright chicanery which all too often surrounds union nominations, ballots & voting generally. I got some flak for saying that. One thing is for sure: Brent should make sure he gets an honestly elected GASB, otherwise he defeats his own purpose of strengthening the relationship with fans. That isn't to say he can make everyone happy but it's HIS GASB, part of HIS structure and he must be able to tell himself it's the best he could have done.
notDistant........downright chicanery...that sounds similar to the Conservative Party......who's Chief Whip threw a wobbly over pleb police the day after two Policewomen were murdered doing their job.......and unbelievably the moron has still got his job, and will be staying away from next weeks conferance so as not to embarrass his party ...... then there is the West Coast Line cock-up.....pure anti-Richard Branston from the Government and it's dealings with Virgin.......what was the word ...oh yes chicanery.......what comes to mind.....oh yes...the kettle calling the pot black.
This about a league two supporters representation group plymborn not a party political broadcast. I'm not accusing he with a title either notdistant but the tar sticks because of the association with others or in particular an other. What comes across here is that Brent wants supporter involvement on his terms only. It is his perogative of course as it's his toy but if it wasn't what a lot of the supporters wanted then it loses something somewhere along the line. It does seem that he wants the GASB and nothing else and the "boys" have gone out to fix it for him. Ergo people who take a view don't want to play the game and again it loses because of this. Instead of selling the GASB legitimately to the masses it seems as if it has been foisted on them through bullying and not persuation. Although personally not bothered which organisation represents the fans I can see where this thought process comes from.
I have taken very little interest in any of this to be honest as for the other sites I can manage about 10 minutes on them before I start to feel my IQ dropping, which I can scarecly afford. There used to be some decent debate on Pasoti but now any alternative opinion to the sheeple is crushed ruthlessly by the 'it' crowd. It reminds of those American High School movies where everyone wants to sit at the cool table and their whole life depends on being accepted by the in crowd....sad. I said at the time I wasn't impressed by the Postman Pat appointment and not keen on this fans board thing either. I would prefer open forums once a month where everyone and anyone can go to give feedback that covers all opinions towards the club and not a censored version. Fans by nature are passionate about their club and often the heart rules the head. As we have seen on here once you have an opinion then it is pretty well stuck and unlikely to change, be it right(mine) or wrong(everyone else). Once you add a group mentality to that then it gets even worse. It seems that all fans are equal at the moment it´s just some are more equal than others.
Plymborn - I'll stick to the topic & make one comment to you and no more. You are the one who whines about the undemocratic nature of the election. Who's said to be interfering in it to rig it for their own purposes [not by me I should point out]? What's his background? Did I not warn you? Can you really have it both ways? Personally, I think you getting all bitter & twisted about not very much, but still. Sensible - "What comes across here is that Brent wants supporter involvement on his terms only." Of course he does, he's the owner. He is under no obligation to consult with anyone and at most clubs it doesn't happen at all. Perhaps we can see why...................
I don't dispute it is his club notdistant and that it is ultimately his choice, of course it is. However, he was also the one who made a great big thing about supporter involvement which I understood to mean independant and not his selected band of supporters rather than mine for example. This all adds to the suspicion in my book. "This club should be in the Championship" means to me that he will do all he can to put it there. *I will not bankroll anything" means I'm not that committed. You could take the statements to be at odds with each other. "I want the supporters to be involved" means exactly that with no strings. Then to more or less impose his choice of supporters collective means he doesn't really want just anyone asking questions. Again slightly at odds with the original statement. People aren't stupid, well some are but not all of the supporters. People initially took Brent at face value and believed the PR. Since then questions about a number of things have come up without there being any satisfactory answer and we are being urged to "Trust in Brent". Well plenty of people "Trusted in Stapleton" previously and we got our fingers well and truely burnt. If Brent wants fans to be involved then he should step aside and let the fans themselves decide who will be asking the questions and not be party to selecting the format and candidates. If Turkeys voted on Christmas Day being banned then it would just be called December 25th now and no dissenting voice would be heard.
sensible ........that goes for notDistant as well....who doesn't miss a trick to push his right wing views.......I will respond to extremes of the right......and the right are supplying plenty of fodder to respond to at present.
This is sometimes like Arthur Scargill v Margret Thatcher. Now I'd pay to see those two on a caravan holiday together......
