Lol Toppy...Kauto Stars performance is now being factored into the Frankel form. Don't like to discuss Frankel though....his chief cheerleader on here gets very techy!
He was making the comments afterwards aswell and IMO he was talking bol**ks - It was like he was making excuses for the loss when at the end of the day he was beaten fair and square. Camelot moved beautifully and looked as relaxed as ever. He was the last off the bridle but just didn't have the kick at the end - I dont really think he underperformed, He was just outstayed and the formlines in behind paint the same picture as the result at Epsom, He's beaten Main Sequence and Thought Worthy pretty much the same distances as he did at Epsom. Not good enough on the day, Simple as that As for the Champion Stakes, I think 1m2f would suit Camelot down to the ground. I think hes more of a speed horse than a stayer - Although he looks very versatile. But over 1m2f I think we'd see him at his best. I don't think he'd be good enough to beat Frankel but I'd like to see abit more substance in the Champion Stakes, Hes unlikely to be aimed at both races. I can't see Nathaniel lining up as he will more than likely be aimed at the Arc - Depends how he comes out of the Arc though, Snow Fairy is a possible the only realistic challenger to Frankel is Cirrus Des Aigles. Surely having a pop at Frankel is more worthwhile than losing at Longchamp? I dont see him as a Arc winner, Hes the best of a very poor generation of 3 year old's. He's already a Gr1 winner over 1m4f (The Derby/Irish Derby) why not have a pop at 1m2f?
Camelot against Frankel would be embarrassing for connections of the 3yo simple as that Mr O'Brien and the owners know it as well. As does any racing fan.
I can't see it happening, John Magnier and connections could have a case of animal cruelty on there hands if they did but purely for selfish reasons I'd like to see Camelot facing Frankel. If anything though he's likely to be aimed at the Arc...
Orfevre and Moonlight Cloud, biggest cert of a 7/2 double you are ever likely to see, easy money. I was impressed by Orfevre, the small field and muddling pace would not have suited him at all and I think hes the one to beat in the big one, Nathaniel wont get within 3 lengths of Dandream at Longchamp, I wouldnt waste your money on him, 2m race on Champions Day should be his target and ill be surprised if he runs in the first 5. Obviously the last piece of the puzzle now is the draw but barring bad luck on that front I think Orfevre is the one to beat, he done it very very easily today and wait till you see him in a real race of a real gallop, the engine this horse has is second only to Frankel, he will have Danedream for breakfast.
hes still good in my book Got Orfevre as 16s so no too bad, thats antepost betting, backing both Orfevre and Novellist there was always the danger that they wouldnt make it to the race, and the danger is still alive!! Manduro....
I know Frankel has been committed to the Champion Stakes, but would you not look at today and be thinking 'why on earth not?' if you owned him? The Arc does not look a hugely strong one this year, especially if Camelot does not run and leaves us without a top 3 year old.
The Cotton Wool Kid is running scared of the Oriental Express, Cecil knows the Japanese Powerhouse is the only other Top Group 1 engine in the world at present and is avoiding like the plague.
Interesting that in the St Leger, it took 6 seconds longer to reach the 4f pole than it did last year and 3 seconds less to travel the last 4f.
It would be great to see but,as RV has stated,I fail to see what Camelot would bring to the table. I have no doubt he ran below par yesterday.He got rather hot before hand and looked agitated but doesn't have anyhting in the form book to cause Frankel the remotist problem. As I have already stated,the Arc is a much more prestigious event than the CS.Why on earth would Camelot's connections want to target that?The race had to be reframed it was such a non event...It does however represent a perfect springboard for other connections trying to protect an unbeaten record and dodging the real challenges that could be encompassed. The horse has already won a classic over a Mile and has nothing to prove at any trip sub 12f.
Nah, he's never been of any value this year. I recommended him before he ran at Royal Ascot last year and got 100/1 e/w from Bet365 but obviously they never ran him in the end as they felt the ground was too quick. As you know I just feel he is an underrated animal who over a mile and a half is a superb measuring stick for other top horses. Over a mile and a half his record is excellent, reading 12112 and than includes a KG Group 1 against the Derby winner and subsequent Breeders Cup turf winner, adnd then a nose 2nd on a head-bob to the Arc heroine. If it rains he is going to make such a mockery of your comments. Pray for dry ground Joe Can't really pick an Arc candidate this year. Would probably like Camelot at these exchange prices at a risk of him not turning up. I can't see Danedream defending her crown at all, it is a very hard task. The French horses have not really struck me either and that is why I think Coolmoe would be barmy to leave Camelot out until next season when there is this or the Champion for him to excel in.
F*** me time to put the cork back in the bottle. I just adopted an Amur Leopard in the commercial break on the food channel!!
I was looking at it from more a selfish angle, I just wanted to see a little more substance in the race and a Guinea's/Derby winner would do that. I wouldn't actually expect them to target the Champion Stakes over the Arc - The latter is more prestigious and Frankel is the other reason. Like I said it was more for selfish reasons. I do think Camelot would be very effective over 1m2f. In the Leger yesterday, I thought all the horses got a little warm and agitated yesterday, The huge rugs they were using on the majority of the horses pointed to that. I thought he travelled through the race beautifully but just didn't stay aswell as the winner - No excuses for Me, But we all see the race differently! I like the little dig at Frankels connections about the race aswell ha, In an ideal world Frankel would be running in the Arc. But I can just imagine it now, Frankel pulling his back teeth out, Boxed in, Nowhere to go and some absolute dog beats him. Then there would be the big uproar of why he was running in the race. Connections are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Everyone as had an opinion on were Frankel should be running, None more than Myself but none of us are in a position to argue with Henry Cecil and I don't think hes a big fan of the Arc. I'd love to see Frankel running in the Arc, Just like I'd love to see him winning the Breeders Cup Classic but its not like hes been running in class 5 handicaps at Wolverhampton is it. I do however think he was kept at a mile for too long, The Sussex Stakes this year was an absolute disgrace. He should have gone for the Eclipse...
