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The Elephant in the Room

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by fran-MLs little camera, Sep 13, 2012.

  1. (Conor)

    (Conor) Well-Known Member

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    Okay, I'm gonna flag something up here. Your logic of "buying it is defending its opinion" is flawed. During The Troubles, BBC News would interview people claiming they were "IRA members", but allegedly half of these "members" weren't even Republican, never mind in the IRA. Does that stop me from watching BBC News? No. Does it mean I'm defending their alledged lies? No, of course not.
     
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  2. Beef

    Beef Well-Known Member

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    Where did I say i'm defending The Sun?.
     
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  3. gomarchingin

    gomarchingin New Member

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    You are free to stop watching of course you are , as soon as I read "allegedly" I switched off , why ? Because thats exactly what the sun did , allegedly this happened when it did not and just because the bbc goes to source what exactly is wrong with that ?

    You purchasing something advocates it a way , of course it does , you would be foolish not to think so .

    I think your example is a tad crap by the way .
     
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  4. gomarchingin

    gomarchingin New Member

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    You are saying they are the tip of the iceburg when in fact they played a huge role in this , lets stick to the facts , we have had enough presumption already haven't we ? Why the need for the sun to come out with such an epic apology ? Which by the way I hope will get thrown straight back at them .
     
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  5. SFC4BAG

    SFC4BAG Well-Known Member

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    The media were fed abominable lies and to think that 116 police statements were altered shows the depth of criminal activity performed by the very corporation that is supposed to uphold the law.

    Yes the Sun goes OTT but they were only trying to sell papers. The difference between the rags and the rest is the lack of long words and less extremism. The Sun will always exert as much from a story as it can and will tread on people's feelings. At the same time it does the same with stories that can help and backs some good causes.

    For me the rag is just that and will always be. Good for some things and bad for others.
     
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  6. fran-MLs little camera

    fran-MLs little camera Well-Known Member

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    The most serious part of the actual tragedy (excluding the subesequent cover up) was how unsafe the ground was and how people were aware of this but willing to take the risk with other people's lives. The rest seems to be just 'a perfect storm'...sunny weather kept people outside, a large crowd wanting access and an inexperienced police officer making a catastrophic decision. The police decision was a serious error of judgement, but the real criminal decision was having a match at a ground with safety issues. This should all have come out at the time and saved the families from all the subsequent anguish of not having the facts in the public domain.
     
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  7. Beddy

    Beddy Plays the percentage

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    Unfortunately as usual it was a case of you cannot always believe what they print in the papers. As others have said the sensationalise practically every thing they can just to sell newspapers. Where as once upon a time they were relied on to actually give you the day to day news. Some do actively do that but papers like the Sun and news of the screws that was, are just rubbish scandal mongers.
    I cannot remember that last time I bought either....probably about a month after the paper was launched at a guess. With the screws it was even before that. I think. The sun's following is dropping year on year and I suggest the new Sunday paper will not be as popular as they would like it to be.
    The other point is as you point out Fran....What on earth were the FA doing in allowing the tie to be played in a ground that did not have a safety certificate.
     
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  8. Beef

    Beef Well-Known Member

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    They were fed lies by a pm and the police, making out the fans did do the stuff The Sun printed. Yes they should have never printed the lie of a story.But they didn't know it was a lie did they?. Look at it from their view, a Pm and a Police chief tells your paper some 'inside info'. Of course they would print it, like any other newspaper would if they had been fed the same lies The Sun had.

    All papers and news outlets lie and big up stories to make big headlines, what i'm trying to get across is the Police and the Government are the ones to blame. The Sun and others such as The Liverpool Daily Post should be disgusted with themselfs for printing it. They should have said sorry ages ago I agree, but the real people to blame are the people we think protect and govern us.
     
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  9. TheSecondStain

    TheSecondStain Needs an early night

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    Reading down the thread has reminded me of the era we lived through. I remember the Thatcher years. I remember not being able to get a job for love, nor money. I remember ordinary people feeling like they didn't count anymore, and that many were on the scrapheap before they'd even started. Against that background you can see how football supporters would be seen to be considered - potential trouble makers, the lowest of the low. There was already a significant hooligan element in football supporters. Many were not just kicking over the traces to be a pain to others. They were frustrated with their lives because they'd come from an era where there had been full employment, and in a short time that had gone - for good. Nobody had told them to go and get themselves educated. They were told to get on their bikes and look for work, even though there wasn't any.

    So we had this grave error that somehow had to be masked up, and sprayed over with evidence condemning the very people who suffered from it. Can I believe the era of Thatcher, where the authorities glossed over their underfunded inadequacies in order to protect their own arses, and where the ordinary person was just fodder to be exploited..? All too easily.

    Oh, and while you're at it, get your Aussie friend Mr Rupert Murdoch to make sure his Sun newspaper spreads the gospel.
     
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  10. fatletiss

    fatletiss Well-Known Member

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    Add to this the fact it happened in 1981 at the same ground, between Wolves and Spurs in FA Cup semi-final, then you really have to ask some questions about the FA. Someone at that organisation chose to ignore the lack of safety certificate to host the game there as it had a large capacity and thus more income. That person should be hauled before a court.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtzHVe2mEN0
     
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  11. Saintsluver

    Saintsluver New Member

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    Never mind about the sun paper, they don't matter, the 96 and their families do. I think a good mark of respect for the 96 would be to play 96 mins of ordinary time at every ground in the country. something that willalways be remembered, just like the 96.
     
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  12. ----HistoryRepeating----

    ----HistoryRepeating---- Well-Known Member

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    Starting at Old Trafford............if Utd are not winning after the usual 90 anyway.
     
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  13. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace
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    Like many football fans who grew up being herded like cattle in the decades leading up to Hillsborough, I watched the live TV coverage of what was supposed to be an FA Cup Semifinal with a mixture of horror, outrage, and "there but for the grace of God...". In the aftermath, these feelings turned to anger and sheer disbelief that the fans themselves were being blamed for the events of that terrible day.

    Let us hope that the families of those lost can bear to live through the re-opened inquest, and that those finally proved to be responsible are prosecuted for corporate manslaughter.
     
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  14. fran-MLs little camera

    fran-MLs little camera Well-Known Member

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    Everything came together at the wrong time...large crowd, wrong venue, inexperienced police. The police didn't do it deliberately...the massive crime was the cover up which just added insult to injury and prolonged the agony.
     
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  15. Clem Fandango

    Clem Fandango Well-Known Member

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    Nothing the Police or Sun newspaper says can be taken at face value. Liers in each others pockets
     
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