After the success of the Frankel advert, put together for the York Ebor Meeting, BC Series have now put together an advert for Camelot's attempt at the Triple Crown this weekend. According to the BC website: "The advert will be broadcast at key times early this week on ITV Yorkshire, including a slot during the England vs Ukraine football game on Tuesday evening, as well as during one of the nation's favourite soaps, Coronation Street." [video=youtube;Pr_E69YmzKg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Pr_E69YmzKg[/video]
There are talks taking place about producing another Frankel-based advert for Champions Day, but there are concerns over the cost as, by its very nature, purchasing airtime in the London area is a lot more expensive than in Yorkshire!
Slightly off topic but assuming that Camelot duly wins in good style can he be viewed in the same light as Frankel? The first triple crown winner since Nijinsky in 1970 and unbeaten. It's a good record and I know it isn't easy to make comparisons as they haven't met - but another legend surely?
You would have thought the bookies would want to promote Camelot on tv considering the amount they could rake in (if he fails). The good side of me hopes he does it but the bad side hopes not. I still remember watching Nijinksy on the tv as a nipper. For me he is the best racehorse I've seen - until probably Frankel. I also think he is one of the most underrated and forgotten by many commentators/pundits. Consider this - the night before the Derby he had colic and it was touch and go whether he made it to the starting gate. In the run up to the St Leger he contracted ringworm and could hardly be ridden. After retiring to stud he did not have the huge numbers of mares that many Coolmore stallions get but he still produced 3 Derby winners and host of other Group/Grade 1 winners.
On a personal level, I can't get excited about Camelot in the same way as Frankel. Perhaps it is the cynic in me that hears the Coolmore PR machine behind every statement from Ballydoyle. On a purely racing level, at the moment we just don't know what Camelot has beaten. The current crop of 3 year olds don't look to be an outstanding bunch and he has yet to take on his elders, which Frankel had done by this stage in his 3yo career. Don't get me wrong, it takes a very good horse to win the Triple Crown, but I wouldn't rank Camelot in the Top 10 at the moment.
Camelotâs form is actually pretty shocking. Heâs only beaten 2 Group 1 winners and only 1 horse he has beaten has gone on to win a Group 1 â Power, who finished 17th, and some 36 lengths behind him in the Guineas Maiden 4 opponents 0 previous winners 4 to run subsequently 1 to win subsequently (Maiden @ Wolverhampton) RP Trophy 4 opponents 4 previous winners (1 G3 winner, 1 Listed winner, 1 G3 placed) 3 to run subsequently 2 to win subsequently (1 Handicap & 1 Listed race, plus 1 G3 placed) Guineas 17 opponents 17 previous winners (2 G1 winners, 1 G1 placed, 3 G2 winners, 3 G2 placed, 2 G3 winners, 3 G3 placed, 1 Listed winner) 17 to run subsequently 4 to win subsequently (1 G1 winner, 1 G2 winner, 1 G3 winner plus 2 G1 placed, 2 G2 placed, 3 G3 placed) Epsom Derby 8 opponents 7 previous winners (1 G2 winner, 3 G3 winners, 1 G3 placed) 7 to run subsequently 1 to win subsequently (1 G2 winner, 1 G2 placed) Irish Derby 4 opponents 4 previous winners (1 G2 winner, 1 G2 placed, 1 G3 winner, 1 Listed winner) 4 to run subsequently 1 to win subsequently (1 Listed winner, 1 G2 placed)
On the brighter side, I suppose he can beat what they put up against him. If Frankel only beat trees, he's no less a horse.
Absolutely, it is never the horse's fault as to the quality of his competition, but the form will need to improve for him to be considered a true great.
When there is no opposition there is only the clock for guidance. Problem is, without the opposition, there is no need to produce fast times. If a horse beats top class opposition, in a fast time, easing down, it has to be something special (no question marks).
My thoughts entirely Princess, i feel in many other years this horse would be an also ran but luckily it is an exceptionally poor 3 year old crop this year. I think it's hard to really talk of Camalot being great as i dont think he is even the best Miler at Ballydoyle as i think that would be Excelebration and not even the best 12f horse as i think that would be St Nicholas Abbey and although both of these are very good horses nobody could make a claim for them being up there with the greats. My personal view is that Ballydoyle needed let Camalot run in the Arc or Juddmonte to give him credibility as proper racewatchers are not fools and they will know the real value of this triple crown.
Yeah, an also ran in most years I knew how good this horse was when he won his maiden and the Racing Post, the form was irrelevant, if you couldn't see it then its not hard to believe that you still cant see it now. One of the best 3yos ive ever seen, I dont really care what people want to say about the form, you just dont see horses with that class very often, and he is considered the best they have had in Ballydoyle for a long time. He is the only horse in the world who might be capable of giving Frankel something to think about, if they run in the Arc he will win, if they dont and retire him, hes still one of the greats, unbeaten Triple Crown winner and never troubled in his career....yeah nothing special at all, an also ran in most years The word going around is that he will have one run after the Leger and be kept in training next year.
One of my main concerns Eddie, is that it seems like Ballydoyle offer up "he's one of the best we've ever had," just about every year.
Eddie, when you watch Camalots Guineas win and Irish Derby win do you really watch those races and say this is a great? He looked good in the Derby but once again he has no form in the book this year and in 2 of the three races he won them looking nothing special against two runners up that have done nothing whatsoever for the form. As Cyclonic states he is actually only the best they have ever had since the last best they have ever had at Ballydoyle. I think he could be a great, especially if kept in training, but at the moment nowhere near in my opinion. Do you think he would beat Excelebration over a mile? SNA over 12f ?
Why would he be running against Excelebration at a mile? He would beat St Nicholas Abbey easily at a 1m4, the only time he has had favourable conditions this season is the Derby and he won 5 lengths easy despite not particularly enjoying the track. He hated the ground in the Irish Derby and the Guineas was far too short for him, Frankel only runs when everything is set up for him. What Camelot has already achieved this season is more than Frankel did as 3yo, if he wins the Triple Crown he is great horse, thats the bottom line, it takes something special to win it, the 3yos might not be great but they are not cart horses, Main Sequence is a decent animal, the horses he runs against on Saturday like Michaelangelo, Ursa Major and Thomas Chippendale and are real decent stayers, if he can beat them at 1m6 and do it well after having been able to win a Guineas then you have to say you have seen a great horse. Outside of Frankel, the older horses are pretty average, the likes of Nathaniel and Farrh, they are not top Group 1 horses and id fancy Camelot strongly to beat them easily.
A better way to advertise it would actually be during ‘Coronation Street’ rather than in the old interlude. Have a scene in ‘Barlow’s Bookies’ with all the regulars excitedly looking forward to Saturday’s St Leger. I’m sure an animated chat on the heat between old boy Norris, Dev, Steve McDonald and Emily Bishop would lead to millions of viewers tuning into watch the race. Camelot achieving the old ‘Triple Crown’ would be a fantastic achievement and its uniqueness verified by the fact that no beast has done it for some 42 years. Also, Mr O’Brien’s clean sweep of the English Classics would be unheralded and probably be one of the best ever achievements in sport. The undisputed fact though is both, should they happen, are going to be overshadowed by Frankel and his accomplishments this term. Must be somewhat galling for those connected to Coolmore. A clash in the ‘Champion Stakes’ would provide Camelot with a chance to take ‘top billing’ but as much as I want to witness such a duel I really can’t see it and would imagine that both horses would end the season unbeaten but with people saying re the pair ‘I really wish they’d have run against each other’ or if only one of them had run in race X.
I agree that he is has a lot to prove but until he gets beaten,or races against his elders,I will give him the benefit if the doubt for now. Blue,I don't quite agree he would be merely an also ran any other year.I think he's a little better than that on what he showed in the Derby alone. To my mind his most impressive win was in the Guineas given his pedigree,the fact that he debuted at a mile last July,won the RP trophy,would have preferred better gound and is a son of Montjeu who had never previously sired a G1 winner at the trip. If one also highlights the fact that he was far from 100% fit and didn't really handle the dip,then I think his win was actually rather meritorious. Ultimately I think everyone is waiting to see him race against other generations before calibrating his worth in the eshelons of greatness. Hype fulfilled or bubble burst?...no one knows as yet. Attempting to compare Camelot with Excelebration is akin to comparing apples with oranges I'm afraid.
