*sigh* Talking about aborted foetuses. Comparing my period example (where I said that any woman that has a period is stopping a child being born) to the bird egg situation, where Jip says that a squashing a fertilised bird-egg is killing a chick. Save yourself for this weekend for another 15+ pages of tedious ****e with BH.
We're talking about different things here. A baby has no life experience, no awareness of it's existence, it cannot formulate thoughts as language is what allows us to think/plan/communicate. I don't know the ins and outs of your son's condition, but children are pre-programmed to create their own form of 'language' if it's not taught to them. I can remember reading about deaf kids developing their own sign language when put together in an orphanage. You son may not 'have language' as such, but his life experience will have allowed him to develop/discover likes and dislikes, things that make him happy/sad, who the people around him are. Babies are not born with much, they can barely see when they're born. There's a massive cognitive difference between a child that's several years old and one that's a few minutes.
It is here Toby. I asked you where he said that.... He didn't. You have a problem with comprehension. This means you just make **** up. I have paid little or no attention to you in the past but when you have addressed me you just make **** up. Very like Med Dog. You have already conceded your starting premise in this debate was wrong, so again, I am not going to place any stock in your scattergun ****e talk.
What the **** are you on about? Make **** up? He implied it ffs, and I'm the one with comprehension problems?
Abortion is murder - simple as Suicide is very sad and should not be legalized Toby should have been an adult in the 40s...in Nazi Germany...he'd have loved terminating all the problem babies that wouldn't have a good Aryan upbringing
We're talking about different things here Jip. Without language (of any kind), thoughts are impossible. If you were to be correct, it would mean that babies are born with their own language?
Are you now advocating aborting children which are actually born Toby? I'm pro-choice but the way you are going about this argument is all wrong! The current limits for termination are far too late on, a girl will typically know 4-6 weeks into pregnancy that they are pregnant, in that they haven't had a period. Why the limit is so late in the span of the pregnancy is beyond me. At 8 weeks the child still doesn't have a functioning nervous system. That in my opinion should be the limit, it gives the woman 2 weeks plus to make a decision and no chance what she is killing would feel what is happening to it. Later on in pregnancy there is still wide debate about whether the fetus would feel the procedure, and if there is any doubt then we should halt it until we know for sure!
Where do you get that from? My stance on abortion is: If the parents don't want to have the child, they should have the right to not have it, as the technology is there for them to do so. The foetus is not a person, it could become one over time, but when it's gestating it's not. A foetus is not self-aware.
I don't agree that language is a prerequisite for thought. If you click your fingers near a baby, they are intrigued and look for the source of the sound. They think "what was that?" Just not in so many words.
No he didn't. You told him "what you're saying".....it wasn't what he was saying. Not even remotely what he was saying. Not even remotely what he was implying. He was correcting you. He was right to correct you. You just took a giant leap and projected an argument on him that he was not having. This is a recurring problem you have.
Your comparing a just born baby as not intelligent to a baby a few years old sounded dubious. A lot of medical research says that from a certain point fetuses are aware. Not in that they could remember it, just as you probably don't remember what you were doing on August 16th when you were 5 years old, but they would be aware of pain.
[TABLE="width: 100%"] [TR] [TD]"Daddy, why was I born with a bit of coat hanger lodged in my head?" "God knows, son, God knows."[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE]
