Butland shouldn't have started because he hasn't played any league football, it's not rocket science. It's what the England u19's/u21's are for, this is the SENIOR squad, theres no reason for including him yet.
..... and so it was ever thus. Thought Ruddy did well - a couple of good stops, good positioning and his distribution was good too. Well done John, we are proud of you winning your first cap.
seriously, why are people so worked up about this issue. He got a cap, well done, now get back to the real work and stop arrods 11 scoring. Maybe I see things too simplisticly
Absolutely Jut read the match report in this morning's Metro and when I saw the bit about how Ruddy "made an excellent save to deny the Italians" it made me well with pride and almost (almost!) brought a tear to my eye. Let's concentrate on this massive positive for John and our club rather than keep whinging about whether or not Butland should have been involved or not eh?
This Saw some of the 2nd half and the pundits comments after - all seemed positive. I wonder where the Canaries fans are who said he was rubbish etc and to bring back Forster when we started our season in the championship???? I would say that some of his saves in the dying minutes of matches last season were as valuable than some of our late goals the previous season. Namely his saves at Anfield and the Liberty.
i feel i should explain why i started this thread as one or two seem to have completely missed the point thankfully, beefy has got it in one in the above statement. this isn't about being pissed off because i'm a norwich fan and our keeper didn't get picked - its about our national team picking a kid in goal who doesn't deserve to be picked. he has NEVER played a game in any league other than league two. even then, it was only 12 matches. i don't doubt he is very promising but he should not be starting games for england based on that. what ever happened to earning your place? how the hell did jake livermore (again, a promising player but by no means deserving) getting in that squad ahead of howson? i'll tell you why, its cos the FA have their favourites and if you don't play for the right club or have the right image in the media, you won't get picked. for the record, i thought butland looked shaky whilst ruddy was calm and assured and made a cracking save low down early on. there are numerous examples of young keepers who have been raved about who fell by the wayside. steven bywater was expected to challenge peter shilton's caps record when he was 18 - he now plays for sheffield wednesday, aged 31. keepers can only really be judged on how good they are when they are playing games - you cannot judge them in training and judge they are good enough to play for england. i found the selection absurd to say the least and how anyone can think differently on this baffles me enormously. there is literally no logic whatsoever in giving this young keeper game time at international level when he isn't good enough to get into his championship club side!!
Again pajamas no one has missed the point insert whatever stupid icon u want, I simply couldn't care less about who the fa pick. They have their reasons however misguided, just pleased ruddy got his chance
The lack of logic at the FA and England is what frustrates me We all knew Ruddy would be awesome and he was, they should listen to us more, all we're doing is being logical If only they'd listen to us about grant holt...
people have missed the point! maybe you haven't, especially if you aren't interested in england and who they pick or why they are picked, but surely anyone can see the lack of sense and fair play involved in picking someone who has never played a club game above league two level playing for his country. as i say, its not about norwich - its about fairness. has it been for example ben foster instead of ruddy i would still be writing this.
England have along proud history of ****ing up players devopment, and I can see it with Butland It was more important this week to get his debut for brum than england. Butland will be in a premier league reserve team by January and then we can really start ****ing up his development Why do we do it, every time!
Since when have Birmingham or Cheltenham been fashionable clubs amongst the FA's list of favourites? If he was ManUre's youth team keeper that argument would make sense, however the fact he's a Blue nose makes it a bit silly if you ask me
in butland's case, its nothing to do with his club and everything to do with how he is viewed by the coaching setup with england. he is raved about by pople behind the scenes, therefore he is called up. hodgson even said they started him because 'they knew more about him than ruddy'! likewise, frankie fielding was rated highly as a kid by capello's coaching team, therefore he kept getting called up. he is atrocious!! beefy is dead right - butland is way overhyped now and 99 times out of 100 it will end badly for the player. i fear this is the case with him as it has been for numerous keepers over the years. joe lewis was touted once, even andy marshall was expected to be england number one of the future!! until a keeper reaches mid 20s OR has a barrel-load of experience behind him at a young age (hart/casillas) it is impossible to tell if they will make the grade at international level. they've clearly picked him above many others who are far more deserving and that to me is extremely disappointing. i repeat - butland has NEVER started a game for his non-premiership club but has started a game for england. ridiculous situation.
If he's the darling of the FA's youth system perhaps that suggests they know a hell of a lot more about him than any of us do, and it also suggests they rate him very highly on the basis of what they have actually seen. My first glimpse of him was against Brazil in the warm-up game before the Olympics and I'd challenge anyone to say that he wasn't absolutely outstanding in that game and without him GB would have been tonked 4/5-0 (which would have been a fairer reflection on the game). It was as good a goalkeeping performance (admittedly only for 45 minutes) as I've seen in a long, long time and while I'm not for a second suggesting he is better than John Ruddy I can at least understand what they see in him. Different, and clearly more extreme example, but Gianluigi Buffon made his debut for Italy at the age of 19 in an actual qualifying game that meant far more than last night kick-about after only playing one season for Parma. Yes, he had at least played a season I hear you cry, but the evidence suggests that throwing him into the international arena at such a young and tender age certainly did him no harm
Yep, there are exceptions to the rule, and simply because many young players have been screwed up by placing too much responsibility on their shoulders, does not mean it will happen in Butland's case. Maybe Woy has got it right??????????????????? I can feel some rants developing
buffon, and indeed casillas, were both playing european football and top flight, top level football with their clubs. butland has played 12 games for cheltenham! completely miles apart and a daft comparison. as i said above, its irrelevant if they rate butland or not - he does not deserve to be picked for england!! he has done nothing. he shouldn't really have played for team GB either - far more deserving keepers out there. he is the 'darling boy', therefore he gets picked. its ludicrous. i repeat, steven bywater was rated as the new peter shilton by the england setup when he was 18. frankie fielding was labelled the new david seaman by the england setup. joe lewis, as far as i know, was not labelled the new anyone but he and even scott loach (now of ipswich fame) have been called into england squads and we've been told they are the mustard. they haven't been. they've been too young and inexperienced to know. you can look great in training matches but it doesn't necessarily translate that you will take to first team football. how can anyone with their head screwed on not see that?
I did caveat my Buffon comment by clearly saying it was an extreme example before you start calling me and my comparisons "daft" fella It was an international kick-about friendly that meant NOTHING at all, why on earth people suposedly with their heads screwed on are getting so wound up about it is beyond me I'm afraid. I think we need to file this one in the "agree to disagree" drawer I believe before this gets innecessarily out of hand
How dare you belittle cheltenham? they're a marvelous club, and with their ****e defence, Butland has had at least 4 years experience in those 12 games
he did well for cheltenham, no doubt! not sure he did well enough to get an england call up though... munky, i said the comparison was daft, not you. comparing parma and cheltenham is not realistic, unless you've done remarkably well on football manager.
