I am reading a lot of posts on here from doom and gloom merchants saying how we're in the **** and we need signings desperately or will be fighting relegation. I'd like to know who everyone blames for this? Is it Martin O'Neill? (My opinion are his hands are tied and teams, like Wolves, are hanging him out to dry) Ellis Short/Margaret Byrne? (Business people wanting the best for the club but not wanting to do it Roman Abramovic or Sheik Mansour (SP) style) It's interesting reading that we are in such a bad position according to so many people. Personally - I'm just looking forward to the start of the season - so glad to have football back
well we are in a great position off the field with all the new deals the problem for me is it that we have a very ordinary squad get 6 or 7 new faces in and good players at that not the likes of Warnock, Dann, Heskey who will offer us nothing and let's try and finish in the top 9-10 players like Olsson and N'Zonzi at Blackburn, Phillips at Blackpool, Kone at Levante, Johnson and Guidetti at City and Fletcher at Wolves would all come in and offer us so much
Can't disagree poolie. I just hate the doom mongers that don't know the full ins and outs - look at the Fletcher deal - Moxey is an arsehole - he has a player on PL wages in the Championship and we've offered a very fair price yet he's holding out for £15m - I personally don't think anyone can be blamed - none of us know exactly what is going on behind the scenes at the club!
I'm sorry, I love the guy but O'Neill is to blame, Steven Fletcher wasn't at the euros, did not at all this summer, it's obvious he's out number one target but O'Neill didn't submit a bid until 10 days ago? The season ended 4 months ago, why has it taken until now to bid for a player with no international commitment? I'm sorry, I'll support O'Neill all day but the guy should not have left it this late and should have had other targets in mind, 6 days before the season this situation is totally unacceptable
Pat do we know 100% that he didn't make the bids early? Does he actually make the bids as most of that stuff is done at chief exec level now - I'm sure Martin O'Neill had a list of targets and sat down with the chairman& CE - the manager normally (these days) only gets involved at the end of the dealings. As I said - I don't think anyone is to blame as they are trying to do what's best for the club - as I also said before none of us know whether we have been speaking to clubs about targets - just because Sky Sports don't report it doesn't mean it hasn't happened - but if we'd approached wolves for Fletcher and they ask for £25m would you be happy if we paid that and left the club in a potential Leeds style position?
I think there is blame to be dished out , but am not sure in which direction to dish it out. MON would have known before the end of the season all the areas he wanted to strengthen and he would have drafted a wanted list which I presumed would be handed to Margaret Byrne who would oversee the deals.MON has stated that several cast iron bids have been made but publicly we only know of 1 certain. The bottom line is unless we get a minimum of 4 players in ( 2 x CF, 1 x LB and an attacking midfield player either wide left or down middle, dosn't matter) we will struggle. We know a lot of good work has gone on regarding the infer structure of the club but without the final product being right it means very little. Having said this I don't think our senior management will waste the impressive work done behind the scenes by not backing and strengthening the first team/ squad.
From the point of view of us fans it's a bit squeaky bum time but from a business point of view we have a top class manager and none of us can argue that the chairman knows business.. I agree completely that none of us know what is going on behind closed doors at the club, but we got to have faith in the manager and the back room team. MON might not bring in the 'Set the world on fire' 'big names' that ideally we all crave but he will bring in players he believes in, and that will give 100% for the shirt. Martin O'Neil is, I truly believe, one of the shrewdest business men and classiest managers of a generation. Whoever he decides to bring in will be there to improve us. And I honestly think this week could be one of the busiest weeks in a transfer window we have seen at Sunderland in a long time with players coming in and going out.
I blame FIFA for letting player's & agents demands getting out of hand, FIFa should step in and tell the likes of Wolves they'll get no more than their origianal estimate of a players value instead opf letting them up the price when it's matched
The transfer window should be scrapped and teams are only aloud players they bring up through their youth system
i don't think we should be apportioning blame before a ball has been kicked... although we might want a few players in, there's nothing to 'blame' Mon or short or Byrne for. Ten games in, if we don't have a new striker and its a lack of fgoals that is costing us points, then maybe we can start throwing blame around. i agree that in my eyes there are places to fill and players that i think would do a good job there, but obviously the people making the bids haven't seen value there yet. id love to see wickham play almost through default.. less pressure on him and could be the run of games he needs to develop and realise his undoubted potential.
I have a nagging feeling that Ellis is trying to make the club profitable, to sell. If this is the case, there'll be nothing like a marquee signing. Hopefully I'm way off with this.
One of my testicles shot inside my body when I read that. Some of the owners recently have been horrendous, if he sells to Indian chicken farmers I'm going to support Real Madrid full time.
I don't think ES is looking to sell the club on.. At least not yet.. He has invested too much of his own personal fortune into the club and would recoup his losses let alone turn a profit. Give it another 5-10 years and us established in the top half season on season, with good domestic cup runs and pushing, even of not always achieving Europa league football and then I think he may look to sell on or even to float the club. Personally I think the natural progression will be to float the club on the stock market, which would increase investment and boost the clubs worldwide image.
You could be right or you could be wrong, who knows how much money Short has made available, or what we were led to believe about the only slightly above average Fletcher i.e. he would come willingly for a reasonable amount. If we end up paying £15m + for him it could be MoNs first mistake and we should have had other overseas targets where there is more value for money. Just as Caroline at £35m was a joke so is £15m + for Fletcher. It has been a huge error judgement on somebodies part if all our eggs were in the Fletcher basket! I suspect MoN has to take some of the blame!
We tried that once though mate and it nearly ruined us, I personally lost thousands on that, all I have to show is a worthless certificate and a ****ing brick with my name on it! I don't think he's looking to bail now, but he could well be taking his money out, look at some basic, and speculative maths. Gyan, we know we paid Rennes in full for him, so £12million in. Bent, we owed Spurs £4million, paid in 4 £8million chunks (allegedly) so, £8million in. That's £20million. Jordan, £16million up front, add ons to £20million, call it just the £16million. £36million. That covers Ellis, as he supposedly converted £34million of debt to shares. Invest In Africa, £20million. Adidas, well, we don't know, let's go low, maybe £2million a year, we're up to £56 million. New Sky deal, again, low estimate, £45million. We have £101million. Wage bill down by millions, and additional player sales have generated a few bob. Conservatively, let's pin it to £105 million in 18 months. I'm all for the club being well ran and such, and the marketing team have done wonders, but tell me, where is this money going, cos it sure as **** hasn't gone into the team, the most important thing. If them figures are even close to correct, Ellis is already UP on his investment, or near to.
That is why i refer back to 2002 with Reid and Murray in charge. With the poor finish we had there should have been MON, Short and the players shouting and arguing at each other and 'we will not let this happen again' remember Mickey gray saying that ?, but they did and look what happened. It is gualling to think QPR with a 17,000 capacity and WHU just promoted are buying better players , and this is 2012 and you DO have to pay the wages, and did we get a £60 m sponsorship deal recently?, Ellis short and MON better act as the warning is there, a relegation this season will finish us and thousands will not go back. When the average was 46,000 that should have remained the average and in fact got the players in and extended the stadium and after 5 seasons back up we should have been going for top 6 by now., but how a striker has not been signed is unforgiveable.
I too have a brick in wall. The difference this time is we have a proper, internationally experienced owner. He knows how to play the markets.. It's where he made his money basically.. And with the international profile we are establishing I can see a much more profitable second outing into the stock market for the club.
I am probably way off the mark here but i thought Short and lonestar were like what Douglas and sheen were in wallstreet. They see a company on its knees, buy it for a pittance, sack a lot of the workers, build it back up again, float it on the stock market, make a shed load, then sell it for a huge profit a year or 2 later. (or keep it and reap the rewards)
