Why Is Suarez's Racism Taboo?

I think that there is a difference between basic insults (bald fat ugly etc) and homophobia or racism.
Generally people aren't attacked for wearing glasses or being bald but people are attacked due to their colour or because of they are gay. In fact their have being political parties and movements set up to spread this poison.
Political capital is made at the expense of people's race. For example plenty of white people fight other white people every week....in pubs, clubs, around football matches, in the streets etc. and no newspaper or politician talks about white on white violence yet they go on and on about black on black violence.
I think that in certain personal situations it may seen to be ok to use certain terms that could be considered racist...I read a lot of liverpool fans slating Eva cos he apparently joked about using the word "******" with a french team mate so they claimed this made him a hypocrite for complaining about Suarez.
How many of us call our mates ****ers etc but would be livid if some one in a pub (who aint a mate) called us that. I say things to my misses which if another bloke said to her she'd kill him.
Therefore context and the people involved are everything.

 

True! but in a public forum it is never acceptable irregardless of circumstance.

 

I happen to absolutely agree with you...suarez clearly did not have a friendly relationship with Eva where that kind of comment was acceptable between them. I think Suarez was way out of line and deserved his ban.

I hate racism and racist comments

 

While I don't disagree with you, It wasn't exactly what I meant. I mean if i make a black joke to a black friend in private it will be fine. But the same scenario on TV and I will be deemed a racist is what I meant. You cannot say anything prejudiced in any capacity publicly. Not that being an actual racist indoors makes you better just less famous and stupid

 

But surely racism is when harm, or prejudice is intended.?
I hope nobody would think I am racist, but I regret the too significant immigration Britain has allowed during say the last 20 years.
It has caused difficulty with cultures, segregation (because we have unintegrated communities), religions, and employment.
My immediate neighbours are Hungarian, German, Scots and Indian. We don't have any problems between us.

 

An example would be Andy gray and the other blokes sexist jokes, many people would make and laugh at that joke in a pub or with mates. And i dont think they meant offense to her but were just a laugh between lads. But it was done on a public forum so it was wrong. In that sense no matter how it is meant it will be treated as prejudiced (as opposed to comedy shows or stand ups where people are playing a "character").

The immigration comment would at worst lead to you being called Nationalistic or Xenophobic and at best a realist. But it would depend on why? if your issues our you dont like foreigners than yeah the former but if you go along the lines it is putting too much pressure on the economy and domestic employment etc. then the latter. It all depends on intent with individuals. BUT not on a public platform

 

Well I'm English and proud of it - and our identity is being dissolved in the face of much more nationalistic Welsh, Scottish, Irish and now West Indian, Indian, Pakistani, African etc.
Why should I even be wary of saying I regret the high levels of immigration? This is the country of my ancestors, not all the different peoples we are expected to absorb. Apologists talk about the colonies....blah blah ...but where do you stop talking about invasion and exploitation of countries? I have always worked with mixed nationalities and to a smaller extent other cultures. I have no religion so don't find toleration a problem.

 

Well you say that but what is English??? Are you the same as the English 50 years ago, were they the same as English 50 years before them and etc. Cultures, identity, countries adapt or they die. England's financial dominance today comes from being an integrated and globalised economy built on the strength of English and Immigrant work forces. We trade and do business all around the world in agriculture, manufacturing, finance and service a direct result of globalisation is the narrowing of national boundaries and cross immigration is a direct result.



What like to add there is nothing wrong with you saying it but people will put a label (good or bad on you for saying it). The above point is why I disagree.

You want less immigration fine lets cripple the economy further, cut us ourselves off from the rest of the world and become a self sustained country. Why would India and China trade with us if we don't let people in. Why would the EU do business with us if we ban them?? You have to wake up and realise the world is a lot smaller than it used to be and the only reason we are in the most economically successful time for individuals is because of it.

My Dad moved the family here when I was 11 from India and I did my schooling and University here and worked in England. I have a British passport and am currently working in India. I intend to go back to England to do my MBA then work and live there again. I certainly feel more English than Indian. What would you have me do?

What ancestors would those be the local savages, the normans, the french, the romans, the descendants of the 100's of colonies we once held? If the ancestors line held then surely the Italians can come and take land as can many scandanavian countries. While we are at it do you mind popping over to the states and telling all the British, Dutch, Irish, Germans and countless others too **** off from America on behalf of the Red indians. Why don't we give back the falklands??

If you don't want the history of colonisation to be an excuse you can't really use your ancestors as one either.

 

To start with, I would advice not to say things to your misses, which if another bloke said to her in the same situation, she would kill him. Secondly, white on white violence is being covered in the news in a similar way to black on black these days. Even more so - it is effectively forbidden to publish crime statistics related to race in UK, in order to avoid showing that some races ( for understandable social and economic reasons) have higher crime rates per capita than others. Even though people want to know the exact picture. So honestly your complains are misplaced. I agree with you about the use of n-word. It is widespread in the black rap culture but does not mean the outsiders should use it. One has to have a privilege to be a very close fiend to a black guy to call him that.

 

Vela - there is too much in your response to discuss in detail - so I will outline and then withdraw completely.

1) My point about English ancestry is basically the people and descendants who occupied England from say 1800 to 1940.
2) We now do very little trade in agriculture, manufacturing - which were once very strong.
3) England's financial dominance goes back to London's central trading base and banking, shipping - nothing to do with recent history of globilisation.
4) I didn't say stop immigration -I regretted the past 20 years level. Stopping immigration would cripple the economy? Nonsense.
5) There is no point in commenting on what YOU should do - we have several million immigrants and families - with British passports - or EU right to come here and work. What is done, is done.
6) The Falklands was never other than European.
7) Dredging up claims of hundreds of years of occupation, and mixing of nationalities and religions has caused modern war and persecution all over the world.
Here endeth my points.

 

A big fat plus one.

In my opinion an Englishman can be from any religion and any race, being English is a way of thinking and interacting more than anything. It was like that in the past and it will always be the case. Originally England was a blend of Saxon, Danish, Norwegian, French, Celtic and now comprises of a huge range of ethnicities from around the world which each bring their elements to the table and improve the country for everyone. Heck I know second generation immigrants who are more patriotic than me!

And to the OP, it's not taboo, just boring now and has been discussed to death already, at least on Not606 anyway.

 

We were right to slate him,he said during the FA hearing that the "N" word is the most upsetting and insulting he'd ever been called.

But he had used the most upsetting and insulting word he's ever been called in a light hearted way in a video.

That makes him a lying hypocrite.

By stating how much he felt insulted and hurt to the FA panel he was influencing the severity of the punishment.

 

Fair enough I will respond to your points and withdraw as well.

1) I figured but that is conveniently what suits you. Ancestry is Ancestry it applies to all in all times. Not What may suit your situation
2) Are you kidding me England Imports food and manufactured goods from all over the world. Trade is just not exporting.
3) Historically yes but the economy is now entirely based on Finance and Service Industry which are global industries. You think Barclays/BP/HSBC/Standard Charter are some of the biggest companies because they sell goods in the UK
4)I know i took your point to a slight extreme. Stopping Immigration can potentially lead to crippling the economy say England says no immigration - why would countries trade, why would countries let british immigrants go overseas, why would they let british companies have offices overseas. Remove alot of the NHS, Menial jobs and MANY MANY people in the high finance and High Tech Jobs
5)Fair enough I brought myself specifically, as I am english and I contribute far more to the british economy and culture than many more locals than I Know, as an example of why immigrants are at times better than locals
6)off the coast of South america discovered by Europeans - doesn't make it theirs i am sure it had locals on it before the Europeans came. Why doesn't America belong to the Italians or India to Vasco
7)Not sure what you mean here. You said you were English so therefore you can say what you want I merely rebutted with what is english. I feel I am and I was not born their. The fact the has led to wars is irrelevant.

 

I haven't seen the video. But there is a difference in the way it was said. Suarez said it angrily and derogatorily. It is very different if he is laughing around with mates. I have been called Paki by mates as a laugh and not cared in the slightest. But if a stranger said it to me in the streets I would be ****ing beyond angry. Liverpool fans who defend him are being thick and keeping the controversy going on much longer than need be. If it was an Arsenal player I would say he said something stupid and wrong he rightly got punished lets bloody move on.

 

Who's defending Suarez?

I'm talking about the hypocrisy of Evra,as for 'keeping the controversy going on much longer than need be' you're commenting on a thread about Suarez aren't you?
I cant see your logic to get upset and laugh at getting called the same 'racially insultative' name,it either hurts and disgusts you or it doesn't.

 

Would just like to say that it's been quite refreshing reading this thread. Usually something like this descends into juvenile insults and deleted posts. It's been interesting reading the different views.

 

People were actually complaining because Evra told the court with a straight face that he couldn't even repeat the word in court because he was so disgusted by it. That video points to the fact he actually has no problem in saying the word himself.

 

I totally agree Bobby.

 

You are talking rubbish. black people making fun of themselves by using offensive words is NOT the same as white people making fun of black people using the same offensive words. You Liverpool fans are clowns. How is Evra being a hypocrite ?

 

How the **** do you know? Seeing as only two people actually heard this conversation then its a bit of a jump to start saying what the tone of conversation was like.