Should these things be kept out of football ? Will it lead to floods of other nations donning armbands? or have Uefa seen sense and are correct to let this happen ?
Should English teams wear black armbands on the anniversaries of the innocent children such as Tim Parry that were blown to smithereens by the IRA? Keep politics out of football and ban the racist English FA for eight competitive games.
TBH I feel it should be left out of football ... but to be playing the same team on the very day 18 years later, maybe it's a sign. Regards Tim Parry, no. These 6 that died did so watching their country and basically for watching their country play. Tim Parry and the other victims were murdered just for being English in the wrong place at the wrong time. Tragic.
This isn't about honouring IRA dead versus their victims. I live 3 miles from Loughinisland. It was a wee rural pub where those poor people were gunned down by murderers while they watched football just like you or I will do this weekend. The armbands could be seen to agree with you; politics should have been kept out of football that day too. And to remember it allows us to reinforce your message. But yes, on the other hand if they allow this; you could have issues with Serbians or Israelis or Georgians wanting to do something similar. I think the direct connection to them watching a game of football at the time of their murders is the main difference. Edit: I have on reflection removed a couple of paragraphs from my original post because I believe them irrelevant to the specific issue. I am conflicted on this. if it was merely a remembrance of innocent people dying for nothing more than watching football then it is an honourable gesture. The very fact that there is still political controversy surrounding their deaths which is unlikely to be resolved means that it can not be a simple act of remembrance in regard to who will use it for their own agenda.this would have me lean the other way & say no as it only helps to highlight those divisions and draws the football team into a political situation they can not as a team help to resolve. I think it'll be fitting enough if all of us who want to, take a couple of moments in thought at the start of the game & then enjoy the rest for those that can't. Definitely a tough one.
Football does not exist outside of the world that we live in, and for me, this is no different to "Kick Racism out of Football" I think John Delaney is very eloquent in expressing the reasoning. Only a moron would think it is a dig at the proddies. As hash points out, there are so many coincidences that it does seem right to draw attention to such a loss, and remind people that things like this should not happen in this world. Football unites, and I think it is right for football to stand up and say no, you don't target people watching the beautiful game. For me Football could use its voice more often and more clearly. I think all clubs should offer free advertising space to a charity of their choice.
From an English stanpoint I would say no it should not happen. My reasons for saying that have nothing to do with religion, sectarianism or even the Anglo/Irish question but about football. If EUFA allow the armbands to be worn, they will be condoning an action that could be said by some to have political significance. Therefore why introduce it. Will it bring any of those who died back? Will it, in any way further the cause of integration or reconciliation? If not then it is a futile gesture.
I can see why people would be for and against it and its a difficlult one but maybe they should just not let any of this into football so it would be fair to everyone.
I don't see that. I just see it as a remembrance and a message. Why do Liverpool remember Hillsborough every year? Won't bring them back, Wont stop the police doing dickhead things... We do it to remember the dead, and in the hope that it reminds people what can go wrong, so hopefully avoiding a repeat.
I really, really, really don't want to start an argument on this topic and I'm only responding further because you have posted similarities with Hillsborough and I'll concentrate upon that. Firstly Hillsborough was a club event and not a national one (with all of the political significance that comes with international events). Secondly, the 96 are commemorated via the memorial and eternal flame. It is the struggle for justice that keeps the issue in the public eye. Perhaps, after justice has been secured then we too will be able to let the matter rest (or move-on as some opposition supporters sugest). Thirdly, we will always be quick to anger when others use either Hillsborough or Hysel as a justification for taunts, derision or abuse. Perhaps I am too touchy on any issue that could potentially divide Redmen. Last week I was accused of being an internet hardman (ha!). However, I will fight to my last breath to ensure that Liverpool are not tainted by the kind of stupidness that blights Glasgow clubs. No matter what our religious, political, etc views etc. it is our passion for LFC that binds us together and gives true meaning to YNWA. (sorry end of rant)
Please can we keep this stuff off the LFC board. It will only lead to in-fighting. Hash post it on GC and you'll get your debate there.
It's not for infighting . Just people's opinions on whether black armbands should be worn by a national team or not. There is no right or wrong answer just people's opinions something every single person is entitled too. Perhaps I should have cut the end of the story as that seems to be clouding the issue.
No worries, but what starts off as what seems to be a harmless topic actually contains more deep-seated issues and the comments raised then themselves become a source of disagreement. If it were GC I'd dive right in but I'm not a fan of arguing with fellow fans unless it's football related. I find politics and football always make a messy combination!
They do make a messy situation( politics and football) hence my question do people think it's right or wrong for national associations to wear the black armbands. There's no reason for anyone to fall out over it though. On GC you know well this would lead to a meltdown, besides im not interested in any of them ****s views, only them of my fellow reds.
Politics and sport have mixed since Hitler used the Olympics as a PR stunt. Possibly longer. The Greeks invented democracy and competitive sport. I remember the furore over the Black September salute at the Mexico Olympics. That probably helped the cause of civil rights. I remember the Munich Olympics, as political as it gets. I remember Zola Budd being fast-tracked for a British passport. Now the UK government have pulled out of attending some Euro games because of certain civil rights abuses in the Ukraine. It's up to individual clubs or nations on what they respectfully remember and how. If they demand a worldwide honouring then it becomes an issue but I remember there being some ridiculous issue over there being poppies on football shirts in remembrance of our war dead and we got quite uppity about our rights.
I read that they wont attend the group games if England get out of the group do the civil rights issues disappear or are they just what everyone knows they are ... glory junket boys
i'd rather they put on a black armband for everyone who was slaughtered on both sides in that conflict personally. its not a bad opportunity and example but they ought to remember innocents on both sides and in warrington etc for example. anyway... i think sport has been abused by politics for a long time but it can still be there as a thing that can bring people together... i mean the dutch are standing tall finally on racism this time round after many times thier team has b fallen apart after black v white arguements
As long as we don't get any outside trolling, I fail to see how this will descend into an argument. People are allowed different opinions, and while it is wrong to shout someone down for having a different viewpoint, it is also wrong to hide in fear about your beliefs, and you may find that giving people more opinions may cause them to refine their own stance. This here, is the cornerstone of society, let us not be scared of it. MITO, I think you distil it too far, if you focus on it being for that one particular incident. I know some will knee jerk that if is pro catholic, and anti-proddy, but personally, I look at it, as a gesture to remind people of the dangers that awaits any society if dialogue breaks down, and one group start riding rough-shod over another group. Gladly Ireland is moving in the right direction, and the odd little reminder of what they are moving away from is worthwhile.
