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Tyre wear prior to pitting

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by Bergkamp a Dutch master, Mar 30, 2011.

  1. Bergkamp a Dutch master

    Bergkamp a Dutch master New Member

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    I hope this isn't too simplistic - but I had a look at the lap times prior to pitting.
    Alonso's fall off was the worst for several laps. Vettel and Hamilton had 2 slower ones prior. Button had falloff once (chasing Massa) but not before the second pit. Massa had slower times for the first pit, but oddly not the second or third time. Petrov was not slower. Perez only slowed near the finish - looking after the tyres?
     
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  2. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Theres the argument that Vettel backed off in the race when he realised Hamilton couldn't get near him with the McLaren so his times may be skewed. To be honest I didn't really notice any glaring reduction in lap times before teams pitted, but I was only really concentrating on the racing and not the times.

    I was waiting for Perez's tyres to suddenly go off, which never really happened, kudos to him :)
     
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  3. Bergkamp a Dutch master

    Bergkamp a Dutch master New Member

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    Ok - pure speculation here - did teams stick to pre-arranged stop strategy although apart from Alonso's, there was not much evidence of tyre degradation. Previous indications had been to expect a marked fall off in performance. Will teams/Pirelli comment on how the tyre wear worked out? Maybe Bernie will want clearer degradation in future.
     
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  4. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, thats about it, Vettel was just cruising, no need to put his machinery under pressure, Hamilton was handicapped by a loose floor board, which in theory should have increased his tyre wear, but did not appear to do so, Perez was still trying, however his efforts were not evidenced by obvious tyre degradation, so all in all I still have no idea quite how the Pirelli's survived the day.

    A wise old racing owl and valued colleague of mine has suggested, outside the public forum, that Pirelli may have adjusted the tyre compound following winter testing !

    Is it possible ?
     
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  5. u408379965

    u408379965 Well-Known Member

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    I'm looking forward to the battles between Seb and Lewis this season. The McLaren's tyre conservation gives RBR something to think about, do they nurse their car round to match McLaren's strategy or do they hammer it round and do an extra stop. If they match McLaren we could see a battle where they're scrapping on track because Vettel can't use the RBR's pace, if they go for an extra stop we'll see Seb pounding around trying to make up a 20-something second lead over Lewis. It could be a bit like Prost Vs Senna, with Hamilton representing Prost by racing a tactical race and Seb representing Senna with Red Bull's raw pace.

    Of course we have their teammates, the Ferraris, the Renaults and maybe one or two others complicating the issue as well. I think it's going to be a good season.
     
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  6. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    And RB have not fully sorted their KERs yet, I'm not sure how the McLaren unit performed in Australia, presumably Lewis did not make full use of it, what with the loose plank and all that.

    RB have reason to feel uneasy.



     
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  7. cosicave

    cosicave Well-Known Member

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    I agree with ErnieBeccleston here: I also think something doesn't quite ring true about the tyre wear. Gut instinct makes me feel uneasy with the suggestion that Albert Park's traditionally low wear rates can account for 100% of their sudden durability compared with testing. And temperatures were similar enough to suggest that idea cannot really account for it either.

    Still, I am sure we'll find out sooner or later.
    One thing's for sure: Sepang is very different to Melbourne in both respects, although it is reasonable to assume that the weather may be a significant factor.
     
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  8. Bergkamp a Dutch master

    Bergkamp a Dutch master New Member

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    Hmmm. Could Pirelli have handed out harder compounds after examining the wear characteristics of the testing? The race doesn't seem to have borne out what we expected (or even maybe the teams)?. Were they anxious that a lot of shredded tyres would do them no favours?
     
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  9. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Maybe someone at Pirelli picked up the wrong tin of paint, or didn't wash off the brush properly !
     
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  10. DHCanary

    DHCanary Very Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    I think I heard that Pirelli needed to produce 1800 tyres for the Melbourne weekend. This is not an overnight job, and they would only have had about 2 weeks since the last test. Also, wouldn't some of the teams say something if they're suddenly getting very different data back? Whilst they all mentioned it in the race, nobody came out in free practice to say that the tyres had changed. I'd imagine that the drivers would feel the difference too, on something that integral to performance.
     
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  11. Bergkamp a Dutch master

    Bergkamp a Dutch master New Member

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    DHCanary .... Good point -thats a lot of tyres to produce late on and ship (where do they make them?). Then I have to assume tyre wear in testing at Barcelona was very different to the actual laps with pretty heavy fuel loads at Melbourne.
     
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  12. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Berkamp: Made in Turkey.
     
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  13. DHCanary

    DHCanary Very Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Hmm, i doubt they'd fly them out due to cost, it'd probably nearly take 2 weeks just to ship them!
     
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  14. DHCanary

    DHCanary Very Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    #14
  15. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Quote from Trulli:

    "During the winter all of us, in every team, have worked with tyres that would deteriorate immediately. It was a characteristic of the tyres, and there's been some polemics too. So we had thought the problem was to make them last long enough.
    "Instead here in Melbourne we've found ourselves with tyres that had no durability problems, but in exchange for that they would struggle immensely to get up to temperature."
    Trulli reckons Lotus was far from the only team finding it difficult to make the Pirellis work in Australia.
    "If the tyres don't get up to temperature it's impossible to get the performance," he said. "During the race only two drivers had no problem getting the tyres up to temperature: (Lewis) Hamilton and (Sebastian) Vettel, second and first.
    "Everyone else, some more than others, struggled. Even (Mark) Webber. In my opinion it's the same reason why Ferrari did badly in qualifying."
    He added: "Problem is, the cause of this is unknown. You just need a tiny difference in the set-up, in the balance, in the track or air temperature, and even within the same team you get opposite reactions.
    "Just think of Vettel and Webber: Sebastian dominated, while Mark at one point would lose two seconds a lap from Alonso. So, this is the real challenge: to understand how to use the tyres. I think it will be one of the key points of the season."
     
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  16. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    The plot thickens, as does the compound perhaps,:huh:
     
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  17. Bergkamp a Dutch master

    Bergkamp a Dutch master New Member

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    I'd be surprised that they would change the softer tyre make-up, so allowing production and delivery. For the others - maybe a harder compound was already planned?
     
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  18. u408379965

    u408379965 Well-Known Member

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    I think it's unlikely they'll change any of them apart from the Super Softs which are ****e and Pirelli have said need some work. I don't see why they'd improve the hard compound when they're already working on an ultra hard one.
     
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  19. blackhawk

    blackhawk New Member

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    I was really impressed with Hamilton.

    Some have said before that he cant manage his tyre wear, but especially after Canada 2010 and this season's opener in Oz, he has not only proved hes great a tyre management but even with car problems he can still do better than nearly the rest (bar sebas in the redbull).

    In quali - he had no KERS for most of his lap which also affected his brake balance which made him lock-up - He still went nearly half a second quicker than button in his KERS mclaren & quicker than webber in his lighter (due to no KERS) & faster redbull - quite astonishing!

    And then in the race...he was keeping in touch with sebastian managed his tyres better & he pitted after both redbulls - he never even complained or reported that the tyres were going off.
    And then he had the underfloor failure which wouldve ruined his downforce and he still kept it in 2nd.

    As for Malaysia - It will be interesting to see Redbulls with KERS. They obviously have major issues with their system which is why they didnt run it in Oz. With KERS...is it likely that they could have problems off the line? Will it ruin their brake balance? And most importantly...RedBull's KERS were giving them some major over-heating issues due to the design of the car/exhausts.

    By leaving out KERS in Oz, I think redbull have exposed their achilles heel.

    In a nutshell...I dont think RedBull's KERS is ready to use yet, and if it isnt ready for Sepang.....that will hurt them.
     
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  20. u408379965

    u408379965 Well-Known Member

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    Webber's car wouldn't have been lighter mate, the cars' weights are limited so they all weight the same.
     
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