I widny know. I can hazard a guess that the incubator buys the assets from Rangers and Rangers the company continues to trade under CVA? Bearing in mind that a CVA may not necessarily be a pence in the pound agreement, it can also be a deferred payment plan, or any mixture thereof. I find it difficult to believe that a CVA is even achievable but I know **** all about the details of the bid. I know even less about what a 'standalone CVA' is (which is not what they're doing apparently) and a CVA (which is what they're doing).
So basically they can't agree a cva now with the old co having assets worth potentially millions, Murray park, ibrox, the players (assuming rangers old co do own this) But They will agree a cva despite having no assets (as they'll be gone to new co) save for the 11.2 m less fees and costs to end of the season????
Did anybody say a CVA had been tried and couldn't be agreed? Wouldn't that be dependant on, and detailed in, the bid?
Bill Miller and Rangers: what happens next? Published on 3 May 2012 Richard Wilson Bill Miller's plan for Rangers is to move the assets â Ibrox, Murray Park, the Albion car park â to a newco, while leaving the original company under the control of the administrators to try to achieve a Company Voluntary Arrangement. The American trucking tycoon then intends to merge the two companies. Here, Herald Sport analyses the feasibility of his plan, and what it means for Rangers and Scottish football. Is this liquidation? As far as financial experts are concerned, it is a convoluted route to achieve what is effectively a liquidation. The only way around that assessment would be if he managed to effect a successful CVA for Rangers Football Club plc and merged it with the newco before the beginning of next season â Saturday, August 4. Miller would then, in theory, not have to apply to the Scottish Premier League for the newco to become a member of the league. Yet the timescales for achieving this are tight, and if he fails to effect the CVA in time and applies for his newco to gain entry into the SPL, there is little to be gained by merging the oldco further down the line. Also, Craig Whyte has so far refused to co-operate with the administrators in making his shares available to the Blue Knights, so why would he make them available to Miller on the other side of a successful CVA? They would be worthless, since it is the majority shareholding in a company with no assets. What about Rangers' history? This is an emotive subject, and part of the motivation for Miller to seek this hybrid route. To many fans the newco being a separate legal entity makes it distinct from the current Rangers' history. However, this was not what happened to Leeds United, to take one example from England, when their assets were moved to a newco in 2007. As far as the Football League and Uefa are concerned, Leeds have an unbroken history. It is likely that if the SPL agree to transfer the league share from oldco Rangers to newco, they will consider the history to have transferred, too. This has never been an issue in England, but will be in Scotland, where rivalry is more fever-pitched. Another perspective would be this: the club and the company are close but still separate; as far as the sporting bodies are concerned any sanctions apply to the club regardless of the company that owns it, so the same would apply to the club's history. Why does Miller plan to merge the oldco with his newco? Probably for the sake of the fans, who are worried about his approach. It seems unlikely that he would effect a CVA in time anyway, but the newco option also lets him bypass the Whyte problem, and the assets could be transferred within two weeks. Do the players' contracts transfer over automatically? In normal corporate takeovers, contracts are transferred along with the assets, and their rights are protected by the Transfer of Undertakings and Protection of Employment (TUPE) law, which means the original terms must be honoured. Yet PFA Scotland believes in the newco scenario, players are entitled to decide they don't want their registrations transferred and can walk away for nothing. Would the SFA sanctions apply to the newco? If Miller is named preferred bidder, he will then meet the SFA and the SPL for formal negotiations. The penalties will come under discussion, but the likelihood is that one condition of being granted a licence by the SFA will be that all sanctions that apply to oldco Rangers will apply to the newco. Until an appeal is heard, this means the embargo stands, which, in theory, means that the registrations of any player over the age of 18 might be impossible to transfer. What about the SPL? Will the newco Rangers be allowed back into the league, and what about sanctions? Even if the SPL's proposed financial fair play resolution is voted in on Monday, Miller plans to establish the newco before the end of this season. That means any decision would be considered by the SPL board and there are no rules in place to govern their decision. Miller would argue that because he is trying to effect a CVA with the oldco, his newco should be spared sanctions, but this is surely unworkable. What if the oldco never achieved a CVA, would sanctions be applied months later? It is more likely the SPL would agree to newco Rangers being admitted but seek to impose sanctions. These would be discussed if Miller is appointed preferred bidder. Rangers aren't eligible for Europe next season, but what about future seasons under Miller's plan? Even if he gained a CVA for oldco Rangers then merged it with his newco, Uefa will consider this a change in the club's legal structure. To be eligible, clubs must have three unbroken years of membership of their domestic association, so Miller's Rangers would not be able to play in Europe until the beginning of the 2015/2016 season.
ill explain because (as we all know) im the brightest here newco let into spl - not really an "incubator - the yank is mixing terms - but is a separate company who purchses assets (question - player contracts? who knows) the oldco continues to trade as such - only real liabilities are creditors and administrators fees (it remains in admin until CVA agreed) CVA proposed and (im sorry here bears) refused (cos it has hee haw worth) oldco liquidated (also has hee haw worth but you cant continue to trade in admin without the profits which are going to newco bill miller says ""sorry we tried to merge oldco and newco but they bastards didnae let us newco rangers stays in spl with - and i only suspect this - some punishment because the oldco and newco didnt merge (id bet miller is making a deal to this effect with the spl) miller does a "bunnet" by selling off newco debt free at a nice wee profit craig whyte pursues rangers assets through courts but ultimately gives up
Wouldn't bill miller have to give the best offer for rangers assets...wouldn't creditors have a say in what is acceptable...seeing as administrators are working in the best interests of the creditors...not rangers
"Wouldn't bill miller have to give the best offer for rangers assets" if there is no other offer then why? the administrators have clearly not had offers for rangers assets, most of which only hold value in a footballing context anyway ...wouldn't creditors have a say in what is acceptable no - the administrators are appointed to do this - creditors would have to apply to the courts in that case (they may do) ...seeing as administrators are working in the best interests of the creditors...not rangers i presume that the administrators see long term benefits for the creditors with rangers trading - lets not forget that a trading rangers probably offers more long term to HMRC and other creditors than an asset sale
Simon post makes sense of this Newco buys assets Oldco has cash Oldco cvas with cash to creditors or folds Merge companies after cva or newco go alone I think that's it
The bottom line is that a new Rangers (dress it up anyway you want) will get into the SPL with no point deductions or very little as the SPL clubs outwith Celtic need the dough. It will be sold to the fans as a continuation of Rangers through words like incubator and **** people can't understand and they will mostly buy it as the alternative is unthinkable. Result? - The game in Scotland is a bogey.
its unfair but is relatively common business practice i do feel that rangers will be hamstrung though - no europe, possible sanctions and from now till etermity of us calling them newco fc
Then why not just attempt CVA and then liquidate and go newco if it cannot be agreed? Why the "incubator" buying oldco assets? Protect the assets from oldco liquidation event? Leave Whyte with a majority shareholding of sweet **** all?
I was thinking that the £11.2 million that Miller has offered for the club is in agreement that it is used to purchase assets off the oldco and transfer to newco. The £11.2 million is then offered to creditors as CVA. For the past 2 weeks they kept saying that Millers bid was worth double to the creditors than TBK, who were proposing a CVA with a pot of £5 million. I think a CVA will be agreed. Via CVA the creditors will share £11.2 million. If the company was to be liquidated then they would share £11.2 million, seeing as that will be the only asset within the company (after all assets have been moved). I wonder if Whyte has any claim on the £11.2 million though. He will be majority shareholder in a company with that cash as an asset. Would he be able to move that money before liquidation? Too much to get my head around.
I know As far as I understand it Whyte canny get his hands on **** all during admin. All assets (and cash) are controlled by D&P and would be sold off in a liquidation event to pay creditors. I think.
If the just liquidate after a failed cva then even I could bid for ibrox....this way its safe . I guess
