That we lost to QPR... it's been obvious for a short while that this season we are focusing on cups, and even more recently that we are resigned to 7th place - I can't see us getting any higher, and we'd have to go on a really bad run to get any lower. It wasn't unexpected, upsets like these happen every year and we know we're particularly bad when it comes to the lower down teams. We up our games for the big ones, plain and simple and most of the players on the team apart from Gerrard seem to think that's good enough. Kenny obviously isn't blameless, he made some gambles that haven't really paid off... like Adam and Downing. Where he probably thought they were a safe bet at the time, they've turned out to be quite the opposite and in hindsight I'm sure he's got the humility to look upon it and wonder what he could have done differently. Our season in the Premier league is effectively over. We're not going to get a Champions league spot, and we haven't looked like that for a while there's no point pretending we had much of a chance after the January period really. We're in the Europa league next year (or as good as) which is more than we've had this season, and whilst we're all crying out for bigger and better things we're just going to have to sit and hope for some good buys in the summer and a serious change in attitude. Try and get this 1 loss into perspective, we've had worse losses and we already have a cup under our belt. Looking back on it, would you say 2005 was an unsuccessful year because we finished outside the top 4? No, because we won the Champions league - I'm sure in years time when we look back at this season we'll see a Carling cup win (and a FA cup win please!).
I agree that the cups are your priority (I'm a Newcastle fan) and i would love to simply have ANY silverware to talk about. However, you're only 6 points above 14th place (15th if Villa win their game in hand) and if you slip up much more in the next few weeks you wont be "resigned to 7th place" you'll be midtable or worse. I think you're too good to not pick up your form again but surely the concern is that the league position suggests that next year there'll be more of the same for you? As a Newcastle fan I'm a touch concerned that Europa League (if we get it) will also have a negative effect on our league form. Throw that into the mix for Liverpool and I simply can't see you challenging for top 4 without some very good transfer dealings in the summer, and your recent record in the market hasn't been great (incomings that is, i think fees receievd for outgoing players has been decent for you).
Legend aside Kenny would have been fired and thats just my opinion. What the 2005 team did was win the champions league. There is no bigger prize in international club football than that. It put us on the map and allowed us to build a strong team that almost won the league. That team may have missed out on 4th but they took Everton all the way. There was fight in that team, resilience and some form of belief. They made us dream. I remember the game away to Fulham that season where Josemi was sent off and we were 2 goals down. We fought back and won the game 4-2. That team fought and managed to pull of superb victories. This team however has been very disappointing. Whenever they go a goal down the probability that they will lose the game is soo high when we conceded against Sunderland, Bolton Manchester United and Fulham to name a few I was already resigned to defeat. There is no fight to the end just heads down the moment they concede a goal. They turn up for big games win and paper over the cracks but as soon as the small boys are in town they collapse. I personally don't buy this progress stuff as Newcastle were relegated two years ago and now they are ahead of us. Whats our excuse? The signs are there and the reading does not look good Awful Home form Pathetic goals return No come back victories(newcastle aside) 28 points of the top 20 points off the bottom Last 11 games relegation form Now they are losing from winning position Poor tactics Poor signings for a massive premium I know we are really hoping for the FA Cup but lets not let the cup run get in the way of what is considered bread and butter. The League. We have to deal with the fact that the clubs above us will get better. I defended Rafa to the hilt and was appalled by how some fans bought into the media sound bites, Hodgson was given hell for drowning in a big club with massive problems in the background. Daglish on the other hand seems very bullet proof so far yet he is really struggling. Am not recommending that the management do away with him but any other coach and my belief is he would be gone by the end of the season.
That's just the thing - we aren't resigned to 7th as mentioned by the above poster. There is a strong possiblity that we could finish lower! Which is unacceptable! Football is a funny game - up until the 75th minute, I'm sure most of us would have said that we played good football and we were hitting some good form (3 wins on the bounce). We had a lapse in concentration for the last 15 minutes and we paid the price and now we want Kenny out, players aren't good enough etc. I'm not sure which camp I am in at the minute, this was a really strange game. Usually, after a defeat or draw, I am fuming for about 30 minutes and then I'm calm and I look at the bigger picture. But for some reason, this defeat is still fresh in my mind and really hurts.
We should care because the league is bread and butter and it shows the strength of the team. Are we among the 4 top teams of the country? No. Are among the top 6? No. The top 8? Yes if we maintain our relative position with more points. BUT what is this about a "really bad run"? Are we not on one at the moment in the league. How bad must it get before you accept it is a "really bad". Let us all take off these rose tinted spectacles and see the truth. I want Kenny to stay another year because we tend to give people time but in my heart (and mind) I know he is not the one to bring us the league.
I care because it's getting ****ing embarrassing now. We're Liverpool Football Club and we continue to be the laughing stock of top flight football in this country, I'm sick of our averageness and mediocrity.
I care because i support the club and the league is our bread and butter and a gauge as to how healthy our club is on the pitch over the season. Yes the cups are a welcome distraction to the 'work in progress' but its an empty feeling when most weeks this season we've either been beaten or drew in games we clearly should have won.
This makes me wonder what targets John Henry and co set for this season. I know he talks about wanting Champions League, but maybe cups is what he is requesting right now.
We care because we're Liverpool fans and we want the very best we can get. If the players went out with the attitude that it doesn't really matter we would quite rightly round on them, so what makes it any different for us? I agree with a lot of the above- I think we played some really good football last night, let down yet again by not taking our chances. Dirk's goal should have been the fourth or fifth- not the second, and by then we'd have been out of sight and QPR wouldn't have had the motivation for a fightback. It's all very well saying we're concentrating on the cup, but one bad game and you're left with nothing. Silverware is great, yes, but the measure of a team is it's league position. The day I stop caring about any defeat is the day I'll stop watching footie.
CL and every pre-season interview eluded to that as FSG's goal for KK. I think Carling Cup and 5th perhaps 6th and finals in the FA cup will be enough for Kenny to stay on but as it stands RIGHT NOW, I really do think Kenny will be moved on at the end of the season. Our owners are more ruthless than people care to admit. They sacked Roy on their terms and at their will, not because of fan pressure, as some might think, and Roy performed not much worse than Kenny and with less investment.
This result really annoyed me. I wasn't even half as annoyed after losing to Arsenal despite putting in one of our best performances of the season. I was annoyed because, for once, we actually scored goals and got ourselves into a winnable position only for our reliable defense to have a off day. Well, it wasn't even a day was it, it was just the last fifteen bloody minutes! You can say we should have scored more than two. You can say Agger and Johnson were missing. and, you can add that Kelly limped off too. But, quite simply, we should be winning from 2-0 positions no matter who is on the pitch.
Can't really compare 2005 to this. brand new manager took a team to the CL and won it, final of a carling cup and fifth after trying to clear out the old and bring in his new. Kenny is in a similar boat but had more money to play with, top 4 objective, and hopefully some good cup runs. Cup runs he has been awesome, but in the league you can't just keep saying the same thing over and over all year ( "luck" "goal post" "our time will come" " we will find our finishing touch" etc) it gets old real quick especially after what 6 months now? There was a chance in January to see what was out there to help our goalscoring and we didn't even have a look. I think we were 3-4 points off at that point as well? Look at how much that is costing us as many have said we are playing MUCH BETTER footy, but I want the results and we could have helped that. I am not saying Kenny should go or will go, I am saying he is not immune to criticism and we should have a look at him and wonder what has effectively chagned from the team last year from january til May that was on top 4 form, to now a team from august to March that is looking mid table or worse right in the face?
"There was a chance in January" - We bought Andy Carroll the january before because 'we needed a forward', look where that got us. I'd rather we struggled for six months and got the right man than bring someone in for the sake of it. Just to add to that... Rafa took over a team that finished in the top four the season before, hence being in the Champions League. Kenny took over a Liverpool side laguishing in the lower half of the table.
I agree 100% on that with Carroll and I know that is exactly why we didn't buy this january due to that mistake but it might have jsut cost us CL footy again! Also that team that finsihed top 4 the year before Rafa, was it much better than this? That 05 season we had a hit and miss Baros, half injured Cisse, kewell was still a gimp, Nunez , josemi , biscan sorry I know he is a cult legend, Traore , smicer blew hot and cold. That team had just as much problems but that team had so much fight in them. a grain of the CL fight would have won us a few more games this season. Oh and Cisse would score against us last night I liked him though when he was with us, he played for the shirt. Didn't understand offside but his heart was in it and he provided some real pace for us.
Would have him back in a flash though, same with Luis who almost sounded like he was saying " come and get me" last night on the tweets
2003-04 season Dudek Carragher - Henchoz - Hyypia - Riise Hamann Smicer - Murphy - Gerrard - Kewell Owen v Suarez - Carroll Downing - Gerrard - Spearing - Henderson Enrique - Agger - Skrtel - Johnson Reina This season Obviously, Lucas would be in this seasons team if fit.
Ya, everytime someone mentioned coming back, would you like to be back, can you see yourself in the red again- he was quick with yes, absolutely, 100%, I wouldn't go to finish my career but to continue my with my career there. The man drinks sangria and can unlock defenses for us too....... probably at the same time!
