England Stuff off my Chest (RANT)

The liklihood of a 31 year old, having played one season in the Premer league, untested at international level, going to the Euros is none. So, at least we've agreed he won't be going...As to the merits of him going... I'm never going to denigrate Grant Holt's contribution to the team over the past few years but I fail to see why anyone would assume he is an international class striker - unfortunately, with only a couple of friendlies left before the Euros there is no way to test the assumption. I actually think Welbeck and Grant play different roles at club level so to compare them, other than them both obviously being stirkers, is difficult. For Man U, when Welbeck plays, his main role is not of a goalscorer per se, but to hold-up the ball and create space for Rooney, Nani etc. As much as I love Holt, Welbeck has better technique and control, is pacier and less prone to giving away free quicks - do you remember some of Crouch's games against top sides? Everytime he went near the ball, it was a foul - a consequence of a different interpretation of the laws at international level but mainly, an indictment of better defending. I can see Holt falling foul of the same problem. Believe me, I would love some of our players to be capped for Englland - Holt or anyone - but if Ruddy can't even make the squad in a friendly, I'm afraid, there is no hope ...

 

That's not true at all- Kevin Davies was 33 for his first cap. Two friendly matches are an ideal opportunity to play Holt and see what he'll be like on the international stage. The fact is we know that Sturridge, Welbeck and Rooney will be going to the Euros. There is at least one spot up for grabs. Holt offers something completely different and by virtue of being the joint second goal scorer in the Premier League, either he or Graham should take that fourth spot. And talking of "international class striker" and "world class striker" is utterly pointless if you have neither. Of the current England squad I think a large number are not "international" class. You have to make do with what you've got, and currently Grant Holt and Danny Graham are what England have got. As much as I love the guy, it says more about the dearth of footballing talent in England that these two should be in the squad, but the fact remains they really should.

The other strikers going for the spot- Defoe is not getting much game time and doesn't offer anything new
Zamora is as "international" class as much as Holt- i.e. not, and he's not in good form
Fraiser Campbell. I don't think I even need to assess this.
Andy Carroll. May well go if his form keeps improving, but currently Holt is ahead of him
Crouch you've already mentioned. At least he'll offer something different to the three guaranteed and he'll probably be the one that gets picked on his international record, but I think Holt offers more all round and is in better form.

 

You mean his only cap as a second half substitute amid much derision and ridicule - with all respect, not a great example... besides he was an established Premier League player having played hundreds of times at that level....

 

All I'm saying is it can happen. And Zamora was I think round about 30. Holt is still 30. You're a new poster- are you actually a Norwich fan or just a wind up? I smell a rat.

The bottom line is I want England to put out the best team they can for the Euros so we maximise our chances of success. Holt, as the joint second-highest scorer in the premier league and with suspensions and injuries affecting our forward line-up, is a justifiable choice. I would say he should be a shoe in. He has, so says the telegraph "a surprisingly cultured touch" he has scored against several of the biggest teams in the world, competing with the best defenders. No, he is not world class, not even international class, but he's all we've got and you can guarantee he'd try a lot harder than half the overpaid mugs that get selected for England would. He would also fit in sweetly with England as Rooney, Welbeck and Sturridge all seem to function better playing off another striker. He is, whether you like it or not, the best option England have.

 

Fair enough. We just every now and again get new posters pretending then being wind ups. Welcome to the board! All views are honestly welcome here, though I may disagree (strongly!)

 

Thanks. I do understand your point,and whilst I don't agree with it, I also greatly respect the sentiment behind it.

 

the question was never should grant holt go to the euros. it was should grant holt be called up for that particular friendly based on form and lack of options?

the answers was a big fat yes, yes he should have been selected for the friendly.

 

I've had it with this "international class" bollocks label

England were going to take bent to tap the ball in from six yards, win headers and be physical

He ain't going anymore

We need a like for like change and grant holt is the only in form striker that fits the bill in the premier league. For any Norwich to not believe he couldn't go and give it a massive shot is unreal, if you've watched holt in the last couple of years it takes zero imagination to see him up front for England.

Not trying different things will be the most costly aspect of any upcoming failure at the euros. Zero creativity from the FA as usual. Defoe scored yesterday for the first time in ages so he's probably got his ticket booked already.

 

Which makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. In the three friendlies arranged prior to the Euros, the number one objective appeared to be finding the striking partnership which England will use in the absense of Rooney - that Pearce picked Welbeck and Gerard for the Dutch game suggests that was first choice solution, obviously assuming he's the manager. Irrespective of whether anyone agrees with the selections, surely, there can be little argument that Pearce was at least right in trying out what he thought was the best solution to the Rooney challenge. Hence, why it would have been illogical for Holty to have played as there is simply no way he will be going to the Euros having played only 38 games in the Premier League by the end of the season...and being 31 next month. And please no more fatuous arguments about Davies and Zamora as they had played hundreds of PL games. Gerard playing playing Welbeck was a failure in the limited time he actually played, and Young assuming the role was no more successful. Whether the line-up and formation against Belgium and Norway will now be changed , well, who knows but as much as everyone Norwich fan - including me - would like to see Holty in an England shirt, it is unlikely to happn and I understand why not. If you guys focused upon logic and not sentiment as the primary consideration, maybe you would begin to understand too... In hindsight, so abject was the service from Baines and Richards, indeed Gerard and Young, it's probably a good job Holty never played. Against Van Bommel and De Jong and with deep Dutch centre backs back, he wouldn't have found any space and probably would have barely had a kick all match. Given Welbeck's travails - who has a better touch, who's quicker and a good inch taller - seriously, why does anyone think Holty would have been able to do anything in that game? His selection would have resulted in the same levels of scorn, laughter and derision that Davies' did...With someone like Welbeck (ie a Man U player and still young) fault was found, and rightly so, with the rest of the team. Somehow, I don't think the press would have been so forgiving if it had been Holty on the pitch...

 

it makes perfect sense! how will you know if holt is good enough to go to the euros unless you try him? same with graham, same with welbeck, same with sturridge. the point is simple - we had three strikers available for that friendly, one of which (campbell) had played less than 180 minutes football in 14 months. i was happy for welbeck and sturridge to be included but surely you limit your chances massively by only selecting those players. try some more options - its a bloody friendly. by including holt and graham we would have known whether they were any use to england - now, one injury to sturridge or welbeck and england have nothing. its not a difficult concept to understand but you seem to have some difficulty..................

 

i should also point out that campbell has only ever played 40 premier league games in his entire career and already holt, who has played fewer, has scored more

he and graham both deserved a call up and that is absolutely true.

 

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No, it makes no sense - as the intention was to play the notional 11 for the Euros. As for the rest of the squad - I couldn't agree more than it was perverse to include Fraizer Campbell, and definitely Holty deserved a chance before him. However, they are very different players and I don't think Campbell, other than taking up a strikers place, could be considered competition for Holty. The only small, quick, goal-poaching striker England has -and surely one such player will be in the Euros squad, is Defoe. It's probably that Campbell was looked at an an alternative to the Tottenham man, not as an either/or with Holty. It's possible, actually likely, that Holt is considered an alternative to Welbeck rather than be considered a third different type of striker to sit alongside Welbeck and Campbell. In the end, Campbell got 10 minutes and didn't do anything...Where he goes from here, who knows, and frankly I don't greatly care.. However, a squad is about options and flexibility, and it's likely that the reason Campbell was picked plus it appears that Pearce sees more potential in Campbell as he plays more games than in either Holty or Graham. He's nearly 7 years yunger than Holty, and whether we like it or not, Pearce said he was going to give an opportunity to young players - young in the sense of age not a reflection of international experience...so did anyone really expect a player who's 31 in a few weeks was going to be picked for his debut? I know I keep referencing it, but, unfortunately, his age and lack of premiership games is going to do Grant Holt no favours at all when it comes to England selection.

 

your post is total nonsense

pearce selected three strikers that are all similar. we lacked having another option - a crouch, holt or carroll option. holt is currently playing the best of those and should be selected on form. it has nothing to do with age either. yes its good to have the younger players but any idiot knows that a squad needs a variety of experience and youth to be a team. everyone keeps talking about the germans going for youth - they still had players in their 30s complimenting the youth. lack of premier league experience has nothing to do with it either - carroll played for england after about 10 games. only two players (baines/green) had never played for one of the current top 7 sides in their career. holt and graham were not picked for one reason - they are not fashionable, big names from big name clubs. pure and simple

 

So you don’t agree with someone so you call their point of view nonsense. I should have realised from your risible standard of debate and syntax that you’re educationally challenged. Likewise, anyone who thinks Welbeck and Campbell are similar players tells me all I need to know about your understanding of football. I won’t waste my time responding to your ill-structured, ill-informed drivel again.

 

your argument is monumentally flawed, therefore it is nonsense, yes

you've only ever made 9 posts and all of them have been on this topic. not one person has agreed with you.

its you who is ill-informed i'm afraid.

 

So you think think Welbeck and Campbell are similar players...as I said, that tells me all I need to know. Some advice -go back to school, get an education and watch some football, you might actually start to understand the game. As I said, no more time wasting repsonding to your fatuous, inane drivel.

 

if you knew my background you'd realise what a fool you are making of yourself!

welbeck and campbell are similar players. welbeck is a slightly more rounded player but neither give you the kind of option which i've been talking about and which you, surely, must realise too