This self sustaining model is taking us backwards, if the past few years are an example of how things will be if we stick to it then I don't want any part of it. Quality being replaced by mediocrity. Some people say that our position tells our TRUE position but I don't agree with that nonsense - Arsenal under Wenger were consistently a top 2 club and THAT is our TRUE position, Arsenal are one of the biggest clubs in the world, THAT is our TRUE position. What Kroenke and co are doing is allowing us to slide away from where we need to be, without investment in the squad we will continue to slide away. We need someone to step in and spend some money and bring some real quality back into the side. Some will say "look at Rangers" so I will say Rangers do not have the clout of Arsenal, they do not have the financial backing of Arsenal, they do not have the prestige of Arsenal. We need someone to give us a leg up, someone to spend their own money on building a squad but, importantly, not going crazy on wages like Chelsea and City. If we had the ability to get good players around the table to discuss moves to us I am sure many would come to us because of the style of football we (sometimes) play. Once we get the leg up we would be able to sustain ourselves, success makes money, success attracts good players. Our wage bill is already astronomically high, so lets get something to show for it. If Kroenke doesn't want to dip his hands in his pocket and put us where we should be he should LEAVE the club to fans of the club who want to see us succeed. We need someone to bankroll a few £25m+ purchases, bring in 5 good players, sell some deadwood to help offset that and put us where we need to be. But I will not stand by and watch this self sustaining model turn us into some has been team, a team of mediocrity.
The problem is Hothead that the 'ship has sailed'. Can you imagine any top top footballer wanting to join Arsenal after this year? That game last night was watched by millions and the world now knows that Arsenal are a spent force. I think in terms of players we will have to fish in a different pool. Arsenal is no longer the destination for the best players. The story about Hazard potentially going to Spurs is just the start. Why go to Arsenal if City, Utd, Chelsea, or Spurs want you? Even Newcastle are bringing in better quality than we have. If the club had addressed the issues 2-3 years ago we'd have been ok, but we're now in a position of trying to fix the roof when it's raining. Sorry - went into anecdote mode - but you get the point.
I often diasgree with you 'HotHead' but on this i completely agree. The fact we have consistantly sold our best players is the main reason we have not got back to where we belong at the top of the table. I dont believe it was Wengers decision to sell Fabregas, Nasri, Clichy, Adebayor etc.. I still maintain those were decisions made by the board. We need a BIG change this summer, maybe a new manager but certainly a complete rethink of our transfer strategy. Money needs to be invested. As much as I believe Wenger is capable of bringing trophies back to the club, i think he's too stubborn to change his strategy. If that is the case - then he must go. (basically the board have to free him up some transfer funds and demand he use them on quality additions). My main concen though is that we get a new manager and they might face the exact same issue - (the club cashing in on our top stars and relying on the youth programme to keep churning out more)
I do see your point. If we need to go backwards to go forwards then so be it, but we have so far been going backwards to go further backwards. Lets consolidate our position this season and even the next if need be, but plans must be put in place to take us forwards. The self sustaining model will make us a tier 2 club. If Spurs end up in the CL and we don't for next season they could increase the gap between us and them next season and we could be a tier 3 club, fighting the likes of Everton, Newcastle and Sunderland cos we won't be competing with anyone else.
TheBear I am certain that Wenger, given the right backing, could turn this around. Changing managers at this point would be detrimental to our progress. But as you say our strategy needs to change for next season. What I see happening is Kroenke letting the club continue as it is, as long as revenues remain similar and Wenger doesn't spend money but makes money on transfers, the status quo will remain but Arsenal will slip further down the pecking order. Without investment City, United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Spurs will all have better squads than us, Chelsea are rebuilding so we better believe they will come back strong next season. Liverpool have proved they can cut it with the big boys already this season and I fully expect them to invest this summer again. Even with Wilshere our team lacks the necessary punch and firepower, so investment is key. Our stadium debt is long term, if the stadium debt is what is preventing us from spending then we have 20+ years of doom and gloom to look forward to under this self sustaining model, unless we get a wealthy Arsenal fan to give us the temporary helping hand we need.
I agree with this. I think we need an investment in the squad and it will probably have to come from either Kronke or Usmanov. I think Wenger is the man to take us forward still, but he can't be expected to work miracles on the budget he has.
Yeah you're probably right. but two key things have to happen... 1. The board need to free more money for transfers AND stop selling our top players for profit. They also need to be more forceful with the manager - show that the club demands success. 2. Wenger will need to admit defeat and change his strategy. The key thing here is ambition. The club seem happy to just make a decent profit without taking any real risks. Spurs are a good example of a club showing their ambition. They have less money than us, a weaker infastructure, a smaller fan base and yet they are above us in the league because they are really pushing the club as far as they can. This of course requires investment and a certain amount of risk.
Money is an excuse - nothing more. We have money, but Wenger has not spent it. We don't know if the money we have has been made available to Wenger - and i certainly dont think his job over the past few years can be described as a miracle!. Spurs are doing fine with less money. We did fine years ago with less money that Utd.
It's not true that Spurs have spent less, they have spent £412m on transfers since the start of the prem (only behind City, Chelsea, Liverpool and Utd) and with far less success. It's a myth that Spurs haven't spent huge amounts of money. I don't believe we have huge cash reserves (£120m war chest) that Wenger is simply refusing to spend. The landscape has changed significantly since we were able to out manoeuvre Utd with cunning in the transfer market. Bargains don't really exist anymore and young talent now joins the mega rich clubs in £30m and £150k per week deals. Money isn't an excuse. If we want to keep up I think we need to match this kind of spending, at least on two or three players.
We do have £120m. Its in the accounts. Whether Wenger is allowed to use it is unkown Spurs have spent less than us if you include wages.
Ambition !! When Wenger came out and said that we couldn't be classed as a big club if we sold Nasri and Fabregas .. that sort of told the while story for me - when we sold Fabregas and Nasri ! This is why I am annoyed that we didn't buy Modric when we had the chance. Everyone knew he was class but we already had Fabregas. So what ! Why couldn't we have both - especially when you consider Wenger knew Fabregas would leave at some point, this is the reason I think he made him captain, to give him a reason to stay longer at Arsenal. We could've sold Fabregas but had Modric anyway. It is lack of ambition that has made some argue the point with me that we couldn't buy Modric because we already had Fabregas, we should've had them both. Redknapp said he didn't need Van Der Vaart but he bought him because he was available .. and look at how he has helped Spurs. There is NO substitute for quality.
We make alot more money than Spurs, they are spending a far bigger percentage of their revenue than us. We would'nt have to spend big if it was'nt for the fact that we have sold soo much quality in the last few years. Now however, if we really want to get back to were we used to be - We need to buy.
Exactly my point. Spurs have lower revenue, and spend less in absolute terms on players. They still make a profit.
It's also not true that we have spent more overall (inc wages) since the start of the premier league than Spurs. Bear is right. Wenger did magnificently to assemble a top squad, but the club saw fit to sell our best players. Now we need a big investment to get us back on track.
I have looked at the account for the last 10 years and Spurs have spent slightly less. Not sure about the first 8 years or so of the PL. Wenger inherited great players - though did build a great sqaud back in the early 2000's. Since 2005 we have not had a great squad - and its been getting slowly weaker. So Wenger has done a very poor job by lettting his squad degrade so badly.
Spurs spend net £8.8m per season since the PL started. During the past 5 years they have spent net £14.5m per season - hardly breaking the bank PISKIE.
We should'nt forget we have Wilshere.(we just hav'nt had him available this season) Fabregas still speaks of his affinity for the Club and London, Adebayor has admitted he regrets leaving - as has Flamini, Anelka and Hleb! Henry and Pires always maintained they were Arsenal supporters after they left, even Samir Nasri last night tweeted that he would 'always be be gooner'. It makes me realise all of these players could easily have been kept with a bit of persuasion. (most left because they felt the club was not showing ambition) The board let them go as soon as they got an offer that appealed.
Simply not true. Spurs have a much smaller revenue than Arsenal but have still spent over £70m more on players than us. In relative terms, their spending has far outstripped ours. When you look at nett figures - the gap is even wider - £153m between Spurs and Arsenal. It is simply a myth to say that Spurs have not spend vast amounts of money. Also with far less success.
