1. Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!

honest debate time.... thats no 4 thrown in this year by pepe.

Discussion in 'Liverpool' started by moreinjuredthanowen, Jan 4, 2012.

  1. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2011
    Messages:
    122,782
    Likes Received:
    29,622
    ok guys keeny said they changed the abll after pepe let that one in.... Is there no circumstances pepe will get the blame for his mistakes? Thats another costly goal he's thrown in this year and one has to be honest and say he's levels oof concentration are not where they once were.

    Is he now as untouchable as carragher once was (up to 6 months ago) or can i say that pepe is just not as good as he was 2 years ago without my head being bitten off.
     
    #1
  2. StJohn_Red_Legend

    StJohn_Red_Legend Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2011
    Messages:
    1,658
    Likes Received:
    12
    Keepers are odd beasts - every error they make generally end up costing a goal. Its probably the highest pressure job in the team, outside of management.

    That said, find me a keeper in the PL that hasn't made a few mistakes this season - and we haven't spent £20mil on him to balls-up repeatedly while having an absolutely top class back up (as Man Utd have in DeGea and Lindegaard), although Doni is still a good keeper in a pinch.

    We've got a cup game against Citeh next - perhaps Doni will get his chance...
     
    #2
  3. SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING

    SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    13,431
    Likes Received:
    8,247
    This one was definitely stoppable for sure. You only had to look at his own reaction to see that. He's made a couple of howlers this year but he always has - what goalkeepers don't? I don't see a reason for it to mean anything more sinister at all. Still only approaching 30. We have the best years of him to come.
     
    #3
  4. Red Hadron Collider

    Red Hadron Collider The Hammerhead

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2011
    Messages:
    57,478
    Likes Received:
    9,839
    For God's sake MITO. Your pessimism is truly staggering on occasion.
     
    #4
  5. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2011
    Messages:
    122,782
    Likes Received:
    29,622
    1. being honest doesn't equal pessimism... I ge tthe impression thats the anwer to any debate just call it pessimism.

    2. keepers who've not dropped howlers... oh hart? friedal? howard even? look every keeper can drop one ok... cech dropped a clanger v us didn't he? but other wise he's been very solid... the unspellable and not work spelling name of the arsenal keeper is a guy who will drop them regularly yet we hear him being called useless, same goes for de gea.

    All in all i think that very much rose coloured spectacles exist with regard to anyone considered a star or world class at ones own club but honesty is the best policy and i think reina would admit he's not not going and doing what he needs to be doing. His body position was all wrong for that shot and he'll know that.
     
    #5
  6. DayDoDoeDontDayDoe

    DayDoDoeDontDayDoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2011
    Messages:
    3,660
    Likes Received:
    27
    Hes been brilliant for us, over the years, but the last 18 months, he has had the occasional blip, I remember Arsenal at home last season, and Norwich at home this year.but its nowhere near the stage where we should start lookin at a replacement, the guys still top class,and made a world class save from a corner last night too
     
    #6
  7. SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING

    SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    13,431
    Likes Received:
    8,247
    Freidal dropped a clanger at Swansea the other day didn't he? Look, he's made a couple more errors than he normally does but still has more clean sheets than most keepers - only Hart was better before yesterday i believe. Big deal. I can't believe that you'd question him. Ask any Gooner if they'd take Reina today and see what answer you'd get.
     
    #7
  8. luvgonzo

    luvgonzo Pisshead

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108,223
    Likes Received:
    67,691
    He's a great keeper. Mistakes will be made on occasion but overall he is experienced and solid.
     
    #8
  9. suarezlfc

    suarezlfc Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2011
    Messages:
    2,985
    Likes Received:
    16
    Hart hasn't dropped a howler? See the CL matches versus Bayern away and Villareal at home. Regularly pushes the ball back into the danger area rather than out wide.
    Friedel, see Stoke and Swansea. And you're kidding yourself if you think Cech has been very solid.

    That being said, I agree Pepe has been a bit hit and miss this year. He's always had trouble with swerving balls.

    p.s it's Szczesny, and people have actually been praising him.
     
    #9
  10. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2011
    Messages:
    122,782
    Likes Received:
    29,622
    my point is if he can't be questioned then whats to stop him not getting his standards back up where they can be... if he doesn't play like a CL keeper now how's he supposed to play like one if we do get back there?

    Not questioning performances of individuals is the managers job, not the fans. kenny can defend him all he likes and the rest too and do that cos of his role but i nthe end we can't keep brushing over mistakes and errors that cost us games.

    for example my next article may well question why the HELL glen johnson lets guys get runs on him i nthe box cos he is also responsible for two goals i nthe last couple of games.
     
    #10

  11. suarezlfc

    suarezlfc Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2011
    Messages:
    2,985
    Likes Received:
    16
    What? You think Kenny genuinely just brushes over these matters? Just because he refuses to be drawn on the performance of individual players (good or bad) in his interviews, doesn't mean he does the same on the training ground. If it's anybody's role to scrutinise their individual performances (in private) it's the manager's.
     
    #11
  12. Paulie Gualtieri

    Paulie Gualtieri Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2011
    Messages:
    1,687
    Likes Received:
    12
    4 howlers this year <yikes> we've only conceded 3 this year. Welcome to 2012 <ok>
     
    #12
  13. Klopp's Mannschaft

    Klopp's Mannschaft Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2011
    Messages:
    6,946
    Likes Received:
    1,879
    Oh, come on. The Aguero shot dipped wildly and had it bounced half a yard sooner or later he'd have saved it and we'd be prasing him. Goalkeepers sometimes fail to save shots, that's the nature of their role. This is especially true when shots are swerving as much as that one and in the conditions it was in. We don't jump on the back of defenders every time they miss a tackle...Give Reina some slack, he's been awesome for us and a large part of the team with one of the top defensive records this season (and previous seasons).
     
    #13
  14. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2011
    Messages:
    122,782
    Likes Received:
    29,622
    if all that can be nit picked is when i say year i mean season then that proves something! bite my head off like i said.

    As for kenny, public and private point is fair enough but again in the end i'm nothing to do with thier private work, kenny's owrds reach my ear and others fans ears and then are used to drive the untouchable aspect of the scenario i put forth. I just have to say he's not been as good as he once was

    Now for jj....

    look the ball dipped but watch the replay of how reina approaches the ball. it was a fairly reguation save (and his save fromthe header was too btw, right at him) he was miles off the gorund and his hands were moving down and facing palms down too. the ball dipped, fair enough but the bread and butte ris getting body between ball and goal and not what he did, it was a technical error.

    the point is not about one occasion it is made over several and i feel they are inter ralated and down to concentration..... the fulham goal is another case in point of bad technique and again the ball moved in the air... good technique would have delat with it, pepe palmed it in the very worst place possible... norwich is another cas ein point of coming for a ball he should not have and we conceed a bad goal.

    You can see in the performances since fulham that he's been working on getting the ball out of the danger area and reducing risk so thats all good but then he goes and drops his concentration again.

    Basically I've not called him on the other occasions but the point is i can cut him slack and make him untouchable but i just wonder if for example lucas would have got where he did get to without being man enough to take the over critism he got, I think henderson is man enough but don't think carroll is. Reina I think can and should take the stick as it would make him better simply beacuse he'd use it positively.

    I didn't critise him over the beahc ball even though he put it in his net which was silly, things happen but when there's a trend you have to call it. thats my opinion
     
    #14
  15. averagealex5

    averagealex5 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    Messages:
    183
    Likes Received:
    2
    For the first time in a long while i agree with MITO on the fact that Reina has been poor this season. Every mistake he makes the commentators just say "that's unlike him" but four in a season proves otherwise. Still think he is our number 1 and i wouldn't want us to sign a replacement as Form is temporary ....
     
    #15
  16. Paulie Gualtieri

    Paulie Gualtieri Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2011
    Messages:
    1,687
    Likes Received:
    12
    What are the 4 ?? I remember a few last season Arsenal opening day and another couple but I honestly can't remember 4 this season
     
    #16
  17. Red Hadron Collider

    Red Hadron Collider The Hammerhead

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2011
    Messages:
    57,478
    Likes Received:
    9,839
    MITO. He's a professional. What do you think goes on in training. I'm sure they put specific work in if there's been a problem in a game.
     
    #17
  18. Swarbs

    Swarbs Well-Known Member
    Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    15,533
    Likes Received:
    1,371
    City last night
    Norwich when he dropped the cross
    Fulham when he spilled Murphy's strike
    Spurs for Adebayor's last goal
    Also Wolves when he ran into Skrtel. That was mainly Skrtel's fault, but the keeper should be able to avoid his own defenders.

    Either way, Dalglish's excuse about the change of ball is nothing new for a manager - do you not remember when Taibi let the ball through his legs and SAF said it was cos his studs were too short <laugh> Managers almost never criticise keepers cos they know how damaging it can be for confidence. Reina is having a bad spell right now, but I think he'll pull through it, and as has been pointed out none of the keepers of the top clubs are completely beyond reproach this year. A keeper's concentration and confidence are only a problem, imo, if they are making mistakes in consecutive matches.
     
    #18
  19. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2011
    Messages:
    122,782
    Likes Received:
    29,622
    I've dealt with the point that he's tried since the fulham game to adjust what he is doing to get the ball away from goal earlier...

    pepe (after down to nine men) palmed the ball out in front of adebayor from a defoe shot for 0-3
    pepe came out v norwich and missed the ball giving them an open goal
    pepe dropped a right clanger v fulham
    pepe let agueros shot under him.

    one could argue that we dropped 2 v norwich, 1 v fulham and who knows v city as a result.

    clearly you forgive him for no 1 seeing the game went so badly, you are disappointed he came for no 2.... get a bit irate over no 3 and when no 4 goes in you have to ask the question... which is all i'm doing.

    In the end if the those things is down to the ball moving... well one could joke our forwards are so bad at shooting pepe is getting no proactice but that would be just joking.... he needs to cut it out.

    Its great to be a world class ball playing and sweeping keeper but if you drop points which are not necessary while other keepers quietly go about thier business you have to ask surely for him to get back to his own very high standards... after all this is a world class keeper not a kid i'm talking about...
     
    #19
  20. Red Hadron Collider

    Red Hadron Collider The Hammerhead

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2011
    Messages:
    57,478
    Likes Received:
    9,839
    Lord Lucan. Are you intending to come over on Sunday and if so, did you see the bus times?
     
    #20

Share This Page